and ah... VSL is SUPER DUPER

Although I say that in jest because I have been guilty of wasing forum space being rediculous and talking about anything BUT VSL issues (althought in minor ways indirectly related) actually, I really DO think that, VSL IS super duper, wonderful, and I love it. That part isn't silly. [:D]

@strawinsky said:

Speed is important,obviously,and I'm not sure where all these claims of PC (or Mac,for that matter) superiority in that area come from originally.Figures can be coveniently massaged to mean something else for people with agendas.To me,it's about the operating system,and in that area there is no competition,in my not-so-humble opinion.The Apple OS is way ahead of Windows.I know several seasoned "PC people" (God,it's starting to sound racist [:)] ) ,who have been involved with Windows in the capacity of programming,but also know about the Mac OS,and they are in a distinctly better position to judge the merits of of both systems,than most of the computers-users on the everyday forums.No disrespect intended,there, but it's a given.These people are saying that Windows is wasteful,inelegant and downright obtuse (yeah,like we didn't already know that);not to mention a poor imitation of Mac OS:has anyone seen the look and feature "innovations" of the long-awaited Greenhorn,sorry,Longhorn.

[[[;)]]]

Just when we were having such a civilised discussion [[[;)]]]

1) If you talk to the same unnamed sources who agreed that XP was a "wasteful operating system" (which I happen to agree with) then I'm sure that they will back up my view on the relative speeds of Mac and PC. However, all you need to do is test any cross-platform apps and you will see. I can't comment on Longhorn until it is a commercial product and until I've used it.

2) I would assume that anything that starts with"i" is Mac based so its no wonder that it works on a Mac.

3) Mac OS being beautiful is your opinion. I don't find XP (I run in Classic) grotesque and I find OSX puerile and invasive. When I'm working I am not even aware of the operating system, so even if it was ugly I'm more interested in the GUI of my sequencer or notation program.

Unfortunately we are always hearing about how bad Windows is, but I've sat in many sessions where the Mac, crashed, needed to be re-started, trashing prefs etc. We all have scare stories about computers; the time my Mac erased the whole of a film score the day before the mixing session. The bottom line is that whichever platform has given the most trouble is the one we don't like. I'm glad that you are in love with your Mac; I save that for people, not machines [8-)]

DG

@mpower88 said:

and ah... VSL is SUPER DUPER

Although I say that in jest because I have been guilty of wasing forum space being rediculous and talking about anything BUT VSL issues (althought in minor ways indirectly related) actually, I really DO think that, VSL IS super duper, wonderful, and I love it. That part isn't silly. [:D]

With you on that, for sure...

DG

DG, I think we are all in agreement on the whole it is what it is, not to get Zen on this topic but it all about balances out really doesn't it so who cares. On with the show (writing music).

Miklos.

Well I can't contribute much on that...but I can just say that I used Mac G5 in the last 2 years and I LOVED IT, no problems except occasional RAM problem, but that could be normal in our case. I'm not hesitating in getting another Mac now, I hope they'll have the dual core with Mac, and soon! And this time I will get 3 year warrantee for sure. (What happens after that? Oh yeh, your computer is worth the same as your chair.)

Miklos,

I agree with you, seeing it was our 1st feature film and 1st time working this way (computers...) we did not look at that. But now I'm certainly not going to make the same mistake, especially now that I'm on my own.

Guy

ps How did all these posts get in while I was sleeping? [[;)]]

Hi,DG....

1.Macs are faster for certain processes and PC for others.I'm not bothering to name people: they'd almost certainly be uknown to yourself,as they're not of any professional consequence to this thread.They are professional,though,and are qualified to comment as such.

2.Ummm,is that a joke? There are electric kettles (to name but one domestic appliance) out there now with the irritating i prefix.

3.Each to his own (poor) taste.(Joke). Personally,I wouldn't confuse peurilty with simplicity,without qualification.



Wholesale erasure is almost certainly down to user error,due to pressing an inappropriate button:but,many people would be reluctant to own up to that,especially if their job was on the line.

Where did I say I was in love with my Mac? Nowhere,actually, though it is perfectly reasonable to love something like a pet (that's not a person)or something inanimate,like a work of art. Children love toys.I think it would be odd NOT to love inamimate things.The Mac.It's a neccessary evil,which I prefer to the PC Windows-based can of worms. I admire its purity (sorry Ridley). Is Slo Tools,as you so drolly put it, a disparagement? I think it might be.

One thing,for certain:I'm very pleased to learn that your platform of choice is behaving. It's no joke being at the mercy of the machine.

@strawinsky said:

One thing,for certain:I'm very pleased to learn that your platform of choice is behaving. It's no joke being at the mercy of the machine.

If you're pleased, then I'm pleased [:)] All I was interested in was making sure that people who read these threads see some sort of balance regarding PC and Mac. I use whatever tool is better for my purpose; in the end I don't care what it is called, who makes it or what colour it is.

As far as Protools is concerned (see I do know the real name), I suppose that I do have a bee in my bonnet, having been advised to use it in the past, and lived to regret it. A case of people assuming that well known brandnames are always superior.

DG

Absolutely.I'm not bothered in the slightest by the impending Intel Macs.In fact I believe they will be even better.

AHEM.... a friend has posted me this link at my request yes you guessed it (or did you?) it is the number 2 at microsoft, DISREGARDING the principle of dignity.

Check out how he says "Give it up for me"
and also notice the sweat under the arms kind of add's to things.

Now, I'm not badmouthing MS here (opinions aside), so please don't censor me moderators, this is simply a link to a clip that shows him at his keynote, unedited, HE is the star here, not anybody else and I ain't saying another word, because there are NO WORDS for this! oh and I can't help the filename not my doing.

http://users.pandora.be/bonte/forumafbeeldingen/dancemonkeyboy.mpg

I am so happy he found the link, but then, it's so bad, I forgot how bad, and actually I feel terrible.

[[:|]] [:O]ops: [:'(]

That was enough to convert me forever, and I DO care who makes the tools I use, I don't want Robert Mugabe shoes, or Osama eye glasses. If you think my comparisons are extreme then look at the video behaviour, that's a whole other kind of extreme!

@mpower88 said:

AHEM.... a friend has posted me this link at my request yes you guessed it (or did you?) it is the number 2 at microsoft, DISREGARDING the principle of dignity.

Check out how he says "Give it up for me"
and also notice the sweat under the arms kind of add's to things.

Now, I'm not badmouthing MS here (opinions aside), so please don't censor me moderators, this is simply a link to a clip that shows him at his keynote, unedited, HE is the star here, not anybody else and I ain't saying another word, because there are NO WORDS for this! oh and I can't help the filename not my doing.

http://users.pandora.be/bonte/forumafbeeldingen/dancemonkeyboy.mpg

I am so happy he found the link, but then, it's so bad, I forgot how bad, and actually I feel terrible.

[[:|]] [:O]ops: [:'(]

Priceless [:D]

DG

Now that is truly cringeworthy stuff. Makes Ricky Gervais and a classic episode of 'The Office' look mild in comparison.

Can't see Herb and the team doing this somehow.........!

Regards,


Alex.

[[:|]]

William,

I'm sorry if we got on the wrong foot, but a passion for something like a girl or in our case music/VSL could have its rough areas. Hope we could forget the past and help each other out. [:)]

[[;)]] Cheers!

Guy

All my girls had rough areas: that's why I always carry a sheet of sandpaper with me.
Oh,and that Steve Ballmer should be sacked by Microsoft for complacency.

@strawinsky said:

All my girls had rough areas: that's why I always carry a sheet of sandpaper with me.

[:)] [:D] [:D]

Interesting! I just read the legnthy thread of the Debussy "Jeux de vagues" where arguments broke out with Nafai23, William and a bunch others. I see the subject was somewhere along the lines of this thread's argument. Everybody loved the Debussy but Nafai thought it was cold and sterile, of course I don't agree with Nafia's harsh way of looking at programing music, it's not there to be compared to a real orchestra. The only part I agree with Nafia is that IF you "INSIST" on comparing it with a real orchestra, yes it does sound a bit cold, sorry folks, and don't shoot me, but for the rest I don't go along with him. We can't blame professional musians and concert musicians for making these kind of comments, after all the goal of VSL or any other librairy IS to deceive people making you believe it's NOT a machine doing all that. I just wish I could of heard the Debussy, it's not on the link anymore nor on the demo section. Too bad.

Just thought I'd put in my 2 cents.

Guy

http://www.vsl.co.at/en-us/67/3920/4042.vsl

best
Herb

Well I can't argue with all that's been said, that is the good stuff.

...and thank's Herb.

Guy,
I don't agree with this.
We've had some great discussions here about the value of the 'live' sound, and the intent by many to emulate a live orchestra. But to say this is a role of a sample library, an intent to deceive, then i'm not in agreement with you. The VSL, along with other sample libraries are more akin to a large instrument the composer plays. Yes, the samples are recorded by live musicians, but i think that's where the comparison should end. Although products are often marketed as orchestral replacements (and i exclude VSL from this), the fact is you can make your sample library instrument do anything you want it to, within your ability. If for example, you want an orchestral sound with 25 French Horns, or 16 Clarinets, there's nothing stopping you, only your perception of what a sample library 'should' sound like with a regular orchestra as a benchmark. Why?
Having a Sample library instrument (SLI) is akin to playing a piano or organ, as was discussed elsewhere in the forum to some length. The SLI is a natural extension or progression of that technology.
If however you want a regular orchestral sound, and you are determined to create as close to 'Orchestral live' as possible then you can strive for that too.
Either method or mentality is valid.

Regards,

Alex.

Alex,

I'm not saying you're wrong but being what it is, what do you expect the people's response to be? If it's going to sound very close to an orchestra, even if you write a cluster of 16 horns, 99% of the time the comparason will be inevitable because the ear is use to hearing real orcheatras. You could rationalize it however you want, but the general crowd will not hear it as you do. You are not just showing this stuff to people here on the forum, but the general public, and they have the right to say it sounds like this or like that with no further explanations.

Best,

Guy

Guy,
The aural assumption is true, and perceptions are what they are.
But, as Beethoven, Wagner, Shostakovich, Schoenberg, and a pile of others showed, stepping outside the norm is interesting in itself, and often introduces new perceptions for the general public to enjoy or not as the case may be.

I confess to a musically rebellious streak..............

Regards,

Alex.