But Paul, I just don't see how this is any different from having a bank of scale runs! Since writing is a combination of mainly scales, arpeggios and chords, how's one tool more or less important than another one? Some might use it to write shit music, that I certainly agree with, but what about the ones who wants to use it wisely? I could see this as a very handy tool. I'm a competant pianist and I could play arpeggios easily [H] but I would appreciate the natural legato effect of a recorded arppegio, just as VSL have done with repetition notes.

Guy

I wasn't saying they should be included in the sample library. I was saying that they are and can be used. What if I want to record a classic peice full of arpeggios using VSL? Would it be relevant to me then. Actually I was thinking more along the lines of including larger intervals in the grace note legato parts if anything. Jeez man you're a bit bombastic if you keep on with that I'll have to get my brother to draw a cartoon of you conducting and post a link... so we can all laugh and be friends again [:O]

Miklos.

Well, my idea of sampling arpeggios may be for another day. But let's get real here: If there is no major 3rd interval part of the "Grace"how the hell are you suppose to do a major or a minor arpeggio? [*-)] [*-)] [*-)]

And I'm not complaining about it but my original question was: "Are there arpeggios?" Seems then that the answer is closer to "NO".

Guy

ditto on Guy's last two posts.

Sampling arpeggios would have to be done at just about every tempo under the sun: totally impractical. Use the performance legato instruments or the different length samples depending upon the tempo.

@dpcon said:

Sampling arpeggios would have to be done at just about every tempo under the sun: totally impractical. Use the performance legato instruments or the different length samples depending upon the tempo.

They didn't do the runs in every tempo... did anybody complain?
I'm just saying that doing it by hand is not nearly as effective as sampled arpeggios. Just like the runs, try doing that by hand! I'm talking about the sound of course. 2 tempos would be a start.

Guy

Scales have been done to death too. Anyone who uses them is guilty of shit writing.

[:P] [6]

[[[[:|]]]] "I don't get it!"

[H] "Guy you moron, don't you get it? If you use scales you're writing shit music!"

[[[[:|]]]] "And how about arpeggios?"

[H] "Oh man! than your writing even shittier music!"

[[[[:|]]]] "I guess I'll be the shittiest composer ever."

[H] "You've got that right!"


[:)]

Phillip Glass.

Agreed.

@Guy said:

And I'm not complaining about it but my original question was: "Are there arpeggios?" Seems then that the answer is closer to "NO".
Guy

No - not quite correct. Your original question finished up with 'that's a problem'.

Guy, I'm beginning to get the impression that after playing 20 questions with you, more and more problems are going to start appearing.

You have to give these things some thought from time to time before engaging your typing finger my dear fellow. Have you any idea, as Dave says, how many tempos alone would be involved - and the number of keys - and the amount of money required just to record it all - violins, violas, cellos, woodwinds etc? And then change it all into samples? And then how many people would actually bother to buy it?

You can play your beloved arpeggios quite comfortably by using the leagto instruments - you won't even need legato to get it right. [:)]

@Nick Batzdorf said:

Scales have been done to death too. Anyone who uses them is guilty of shit writing.
[:P] [6]

Well naturally you would say that my dear old chap! Scales have always been a problem for someone who's main instrument is the....... recorder. [:O]ops: [6] [:D]

@mpower88 said:

I wasn't saying they should be included in the sample library. I was saying that they are and can be used. What if I want to record a classic peice full of arpeggios using VSL? Would it be relevant to me then. Actually I was thinking more along the lines of including larger intervals in the grace note legato parts if anything. Jeez man you're a bit bombastic if you keep on with that I'll have to get my brother to draw a cartoon of you conducting and post a link... so we can all laugh and be friends again [:O]
Miklos.

Miklos - the only possible response to this is: -

High on hill with a mountain goat - yodle lay - yodle lay- yo ho lay hee ho!

Noodling.

Arpeggios for those on a budget.

[H]

Guy's point about runs and arpeggios is valid, you can't argue that, what's the different between major and minor arpeggios in all the keys vs major and minor scales in all the keys, all the tempos is not necessary, and if you use melodyne, they're very practical, even if you take sections of the runs/arpeggios, and I read an early post where somebody used melodyne to peice together different runs from different keys and various part of those runs in a preliminary technique to achieve fast string runs aka john williams string runs, plenty of scaled runs there I believe, if he's a shit writer, count me in.

Miklos.

Miklos, you have helped me quite a bit so far and of course others too, so I occasionally should return something. I happen to do what you dscribed in your last paragraph, and it is highly effective! But it demands great ear cordination, but once you get it... Eventually, I'll put a piece out there. At this moment many of my best demos are held hostage, it's a long story...

Paul,

I invisioned the arpeggios with the same approach. So yes, I do put thought in what I write before letting my fingers go on my type writer keyboard. [[;)]]

Ahem.. not to get in the middle of this, but if I recall correctly (correct me if I'm wrong) a VSL staff member once mentioned that arpeggios were going to be one of the new features of the Symphonic Cube - they were going to work through the Performance Tool, not unlike the repetitions now.

...and where is this Symphonic Cube (HD)? I'm,frankly,amazed that VSL currently does not have "Pro" library for sale. [*-)]

@Guy said:

They didn't do the runs in every tempo... did anybody complain?I'm just saying that doing it by hand is not nearly as effective as sampled arpeggios. Just like the runs, try doing that by hand! I'm talking about the sound of course. 2 tempos would be a start.Guy

You can't use the string runs on successive beats in a given tempo unless it's exactly at the given tempo. You can use them on (say) beat four as a rush into beat one. In this case you can adjust the entrance so it feels right. To have arpeggios which would tend to be used on successive beats, the tempo would have to be exact and you would not be able to cheat as with the runs.

I have pieces with played in runs and arpeggios and they sound fine and have the emphasis exactly where they belong down to the 32nd note. You can't do this with sampled performances. It's like having another composer write not exactly what you wanted.

If you're cutting and pasteing like with a James Brown vocal over a groove that's another story.

Dave,

I have to say I disagree. How you adapt to your tools is just as important as your talent. (I'm not talking about existing classical pieces, but composing new works using VSL). Beethoven wrote very effective parts for the french horn despite it's great limitatins of the time. What ever is there your job is to adapt your musicality skills to it. A totally different way of thinking than scoring for a real orchestra.