Multiple Stops (Simultaneously) on the Konzerthous Organ

[152617]

Hi,

Just downloaded my first VSL library, the Konzerthouse Organ and I'm not at all familiar with the VSL interface so and my question may be a pretty dumb one.  What I'm wondering is how do I layer the organ stops on top of each other.  I see how to create a matrix of individual sounds but they all play separately.  If I want, for example, to play a basic combination on a virtual 'Swell', so to speak, "Full 8, 4, 2", I don't see how to create that as one sound.  Do I have to create separate tracks for each individual stop, then play it once and copy it into each?  With an organ, I have three (or more) keyboards plus pedalboard and I pre-select a combination of stops for for each and then modify them during the piece so I imagine it has to be able to do that, I'm just missing it. 

I appreciate any input :)

Dave Mackie

[PaoloT]

I have used Vienna Ensemble to create mixtures. Assign a different register to each VE channel. All registers/channels for a manual go to the same Midi channel. Each manual can be grouped into a separate VE instance. Then, use the Mute buttons in VE to turn the various registers on or off.

Paolo

[Dietz]

@PaoloT said:

I have used Vienna Ensemble to create mixtures. Assign a different register to each VE channel. All registers/channels for a manual go to the same Midi channel. Each manual can be grouped into a separate VE instance. Then, use the Mute buttons in VE to turn the various registers on or off.

Paolo

^^^^^^^^^ This! 😊 

[152617]

Thanks for the responses.  I think that works.  I was opening just the instrument in MOTU's DP rather than the ensemble.

I must say that the sound of the samples is glorious, spectacular.  However, it also must be said that the implementation seems off the mark for an organ library (see the Hauptwerk Virtual Library for an effective, though a bit brutish version).  It feels  like it was forced into the VSL interface design rather than having been aligned to the way an organ is organized and functions.  Organ layout is all about choosing and layering sounds easily and quickly.  If you could select multiple samples in the grid it would be helpful.  The mod wheel or key switches could change the registration of the swell, great or pedal or other manuals.   But modern organs have dozens of buttons, for fingers and toes to switch quickly and all that is perfect for a VSL organ template.

Oh well, thanks for the tip on how to achieve this, it works well (although it'll take a while to get comfortable with it).  And indeed, it is a true pleasure to play, the samples are just beautiful!  It really should be part of every orchestrators kit.  Nothing more glorious than an organ to reinforce a majestic theme or to create a fragile moment of beauty!

Dave

[Dietz]

Thanks for the friendly words, Dave. We put lots of effort into the recordings, and even more so into post-production, so it's good to hear that you like the results we achieved. :-)

I understand your scepticism regarding the generic graphical interface. Maybe it's worth upgrading the free version of Vienna Ensemble to the full-fledged Vienna Ensemble Pro, therefore (... often referred to as "VEP" or "VE Pro" here). VE Pro allows for the remote control of pretty much every single parameter, so you could easily adapt an existing hardware controller of your liking for its use with complex templates of Vienna Konzerthaus Organ. An alternative to actual hardware would be one of the many touch-screen based devices that allows for free configuration of virtual control elements, like buttons, sliders, or even the selection of pre-set registrations. There are even Android- and iOS-based applications that follow the same idea.

Kind regards,

[PaoloT]

I have it, but I don't use it. However, I’ve seen that you can with relative ease build any control console you want with TouchOSC:

https://hexler.net/products/touchosc

I've discovered that physical consoles for Hauptwerk start from very reasonable prices. I could be tempted!

Paolo

[PaoloT]

...all the above, doesn't exclude that a refresh of the Konzerthaus organ software, with a dedicated player, would be more than welcome!

Paolo

[William]

Paolo's idea is good. Another very easy way to layer stops and switch instantly is to create a new instrument in VI that has up to 16 selected stops combined for each keyswitched slot.  So you have 12 slots with 1 to 16 stops each if you want - on just one horizontal matrix instantly selected.  You can add even more vertically. That can be saved as an instrument for whatever composition and would have far more stop arrangements than a normal organ performance would call for.

The Hauptwerk is nice with the luxurious wood grain graphics etc. but not really needed that much for actual audio (unless you want one of those particular organs). Also the Vienna organ is so great with every stop and pipe sampled flawlessly within the awesome hall of Vienna Konzerthaus.  It's really one of the most perfectly sampled instruments in existence. 

[PaoloT]

I wouldn't personally like a fake-wood simulated console from VSL. They have great design ideas, with a "future-is-now" feel that I find at the same time enjoying and functional. Following the style of the Synchron Player would work great, for me. Pastel colors, easy accessibility, stylish and effective.

But I admit to find that the way a traditional organ works is a smart way. Modern synthesizers are nothing than the heirs of these big instruments with separate additive-synthesis patches that can be memorized into quick-select presets. So, the concept can be easily moved to a modern user interface.

The Konzerthaus Organ is recorded in a reverberant hall: in a way, it is more current than other libraries of that era. It deserves to be kept as a peer next to the Synchron collection.

Paolo

[William]

You're right, the organ is like Synchron in that it is ready to go right out of the box with its necessarily built-in reverb.  I am not sure this is right but I believe the audible positioning of the pipes is also the exact stereo image you would have of the organ if you were in the hall.    

[Dietz]

@Another User said:

 

 I am not sure this is right but I believe the audible positioning of the pipes is also the exact stereo image you would have of the organ if you were in the hall.  

Yes, exactly. 

VSL trivia: The Konzerthaus Organ has been recorded with the same microphone setup we used for the creation of the virtual Vienna Konzerthaus you find in MIR Pro's RoomPack 1, i.e. in Ambisonics. This means that we were able to sculpt the number and directivity of the virtual capsules in the studio, during post-production.  . 😊

[William]

That makes it perfect for using alongside of orchestral instruments in MIR.  The ultimate demonstration of this would be a recording of Saint Saens Organ Symphony which "surrounds" the orchestra with the rich sound of the pipe organ.