Vienna Symphonic Library Forum
Forum Statistics

196,023 users have contributed to 43,014 threads and 258,388 posts.

In the past 24 hours, we have 3 new thread(s), 20 new post(s) and 128 new user(s).

  1. Home
  2. Sample Libraries
  3. Vienna Instruments Libraries
  4. Expression map questions

  • Expression map questions

    V
    V

    Hi everybody!

    It is holiday time and I am able to bother with some concepts like expression maps for Cubase 5.

    It seems like a wonderful idea. But I am not yet right there to use it with ease.

    [:D]

    I have Se and Se+, all extended plus a few of the larger Dvd collection. For now, I would start to concentrate on the Se+  solostring maps.

    With the solo violin+ loaded, I added the corresponding matrix.

    - In the matrix there are certain combination sounds like 1B: staccato/sustain that I cannot trigger. I tried non legato+ accent or non legato+sfz

    - what about spiccato? I did not see it in the list?

    -Why is con sordino listed? It doesnt exist in SE

    - In the Vst expression set up there are in the sound slots column  quite a few non sensical entries like "legato+stacc". I dont get the point as it results in a simple staccato.
  • andiA
    VSL Team
    andiA

    Hello veetguitar!

    Please be careful that you always have the right combination of VI matrix and Expression Map.
    Spiccato is included in the SE+ Expression Maps for the Strings. Take another look. ;-)
    Con sordino is included in the SE+ Orchestral Strings matrices.
    You are right though, that the combined cell staccato/sustain is not included in the Expression Map.

    Here is why entries like legato+staccato are indeed useful. Say you have a legato section, which is interrupted with some staccato notes. The staccato marks are only valid for the notes they are attached to and do not end legato. So these notes have the expressions legato and staccato attached to them. In order to play the right articulation (in this case staccato) a rule has to be made.

    Best regards,
    Andi

    Vienna Symphonic Library
  • A
    A

    The VSL supplied expression maps were so confusing and "buggy"  (they caused Nuendo's midi editor to become sluggish) I just made my own from scratch.
  • V
    V

    They were a good starting point. You can simply delete the sound slots that you dont need.

    But another matter interests me more:

    What is your experience with really complex expression maps?

    Do they work without bugs?

    I dont think so. Some mistakes are happening. For example when I play back the same passage 2 or 3 times, it can happen that one articulation changes randomly.

    The other thing that bugs me is that you have to draw in the direction type of events in a super-precise way. Otherwise the note executes the "previous" sound. What I mean is that when I draw in legato or something it  look like it is drawn at the beginning of the event. Sometimes, only when zooming in I realize that it was just a tad after the beginning of the note and thus does affect that note.

    Any shared experience with regular users Vst expression would be very welcome. After all Vst expression is just what makes complex stuf like Vsl usable.

    Who wants to memorize three or four key switches for each and  every articulation (the between 15 and 100?)
  • andiA
    VSL Team
    andiA

    Hello Veetguitar!

    It's not necessary to draw in the direction-type expressions "super-precise". They just have to be before the note.

    I didn't experience that random changes yet. Can you give a detailed example?

    Best,
    Andi

    Vienna Symphonic Library
  • V
    V

    Drawing in before the event seems the obvious solution.

    Concerning random changes: I have noted them. There are not very often and just random. That makes it impossible to reproduce. [B]
  • A
    A

    I keep mine real simple and just use Attributes, one assignment per articulation.  Having all the Directions and Attributes under different Groups was confusing and like I said was buggy and sluggish in the midi editor, and you would get combinations that had no sound assigned.

    One thing that threw me for a loop is that the key range for the switches for the violins etc were at C1 in VE but in the Expression map I had to note them at C0 for them to work.  But on the Bassi the range was E5 for both sides of the equation.  Not sure what's up with that.
  • V
    V

    Maybe we have to ask Vsl to bring on their version of Vst expression.

    http://forum.cubase.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=138472

    See esp. the 6th post with a couple of links.