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  • Controller for VI

    I´m not happy with my current setup of MIDI-Controllers (Yamaha YUS5-SI, Novation X-Station) to control VI, so I decided to think it over from the ground. In another thread I asked about Euphonics MC Control, there ddunn mentioned he uses a Jazzmutant Lemur. What are you folks using? Any suggestions or workarounds (including breath-controllers, data-gloves or whatever) welcome.

  •  I just recently picked up a Wiimote for controlling VI and I have to say after trying it out it's very intuitive to use and cheap too! Only cost 40 euro.

    It requires a bluetooth dongle or device on your computer  and two freeware applications to use on the PC(glovepie,MIDIOX) as far as Ive been able to find thou there might be other simpler methods, for mac I think there is  only one appl needed(wiitoMIDI or some such). Sound on sound will be doing a feature on using the Wiimote for music applications next month.  It can also be used like frontier designs tranzport as a portable controller for your sequencer.  I've found it better for some string artic than a breath controller.


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    @tim harper said:

     I just recently picked up a Wiimote for controlling VI and I have to say after trying it out it's very intuitive to use and cheap too! Only cost 40 euro.

    It requires a bluetooth dongle or device on your computer  and two freeware applications to use on the PC(glovepie,MIDIOX) as far as Ive been able to find thou there might be other simpler methods, for mac I think there is  only one appl needed(wiitoMIDI or some such). Sound on sound will be doing a feature on using the Wiimote for music applications next month.  It can also be used like frontier designs tranzport as a portable controller for your sequencer.  I've found it better for some string artic than a breath controller.

    Hehe, very clever! I like things like that. What are you using the Wiimote for, expression?

  • Heres the handy bit about the controller: because the wiimote sends X and Y data (basically rotating left or right or dipping the wii up and down) I assign one to velocity Xfade and the other to expression so its like a 3D controller for loudness.  Its takes a while to get used to (Iam still experimenting) but definitely worth it for the mulah.


  • Hi Tim, One question though: How long does the Wiimote last when being used as a midi controller? Thanks, Hans-Peter

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    @tim harper said:

    Heres the handy bit about the controller: because the wiimote sends X and Y data (basically rotating left or right or dipping the wii up and down) I assign one to velocity Xfade and the other to expression so its like a 3D controller for loudness.  Its takes a while to get used to (Iam still experimenting) but definitely worth it for the mulah.

    Have you thought about taping the wiimote on your head? Bowing the head is an organic musical movement, and that would leave one hand free. I think I´ll try that. Must look incredibly silly though, so I´ll make sure the window blinds are down. :)

  • Ive only heard of someone straping it too their head in the context of using it to control a first-person-shooter PC game.  I think I'd get alot of neck strain if I used that for MIDI control, especially after those fast staccatto runs ;p  Someone else straped it to a guitar neck so the motion while playing would automate the distortion tone and volume.  Id be curious to see how people use it to automate expression in sample based instruments.

    Musicmaster-The Wiimote runs on two AA batteries, Ive used it for a few hours, so far so good, you can also get chargers for the Wiimotes on ebay thou if used with re-batteries.


  • This is a very nice toy, but I would be more interested in finding a way to use motor faders for cc-automation. In Logic it seems to me, there is no way to get a midi feedback from VE via Logic back to the controller. The idea is to play your song from any point of the timeline getting the actual midi values (of expression, BreathControl, attack, ...) on each fader. You might even use a behringer BCF for that purpose wich saves a lot of money. Correct me if I'm wrong (cause I would really like to be wrong:), but this seems to be only possible for Volume, Pan and maybe some AU Plugins inside Logic...

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    @fritzflotow_27429 said:

    This is a very nice toy, but I would be more interested in finding a way to use motor faders for cc-automation. In Logic it seems to me, there is no way to get a midi feedback from VE via Logic back to the controller. The idea is to play your song from any point of the timeline getting the actual midi values (of expression, BreathControl, attack, ...) on each fader. You might even use a behringer BCF for that purpose wich saves a lot of money. Correct me if I'm wrong (cause I would really like to be wrong😊, but this seems to be only possible for Volume, Pan and maybe some AU Plugins inside Logic...
    I hope someone corrects you... But you don´t really think about a Behringer controlling VSL? This is blasphemy 😊 And besides, as far as I know the faders on the BCF are not touch-sensitive, and I guess you would like to just grab and change while playing rather than just see what is going on.

  • If you are after a touch sensitive controller for VSL I'd also recommmend the novation nocturn, with automap 2 it's very efficient, hasnt got any faders though. 

    Clemenshass is right about the BCF, I used it with Cubase for a while, although it has motorized faders, handy for recall, but not very good for automation. 


  • Hey, don't get me wrong! I'm not voting for Behringer! For sure NOT. I was just giving an example for an inexpensive controller with motorized faders. You could take a mackie baby hui instead - whatever! I wouldn't insist on faders - endless rotary controlls would be fine, too. That doesn't solve the real problem, though: Logic only recieves relative cc-values for pan and other stuff in the chanel strip. Motorized controllers on the other hand need feedback as to react on the changes. This is also not possible for midi cc in an external midi-device like VE. So, if you have a multi instrument connected to the VE unit you cannot correct/modify your sequenced cc- values, as you could with Volume on an audio track - either by taking over the motorized fader's movement, or by endless rotary controllers sending relative values. I am very sure, that this was not possible with Logic 7. There might be a workaround in Logic 8, wich I am new to. As I said: You would really cheer me up, if someone could proove me wrong!

  • I was just looking for the novation nocturn. It's cheap an seems to have good options for VI-Controlling. Can you tell me exactly, how you use it? Does it get any feedback, when you change the midi track? What is this Automap Universal 2.0?

  • Automap scans all your plugins so when you open a plug-in in your sequencer the noturn has all of its controls mapped automatically, you can easily change the configuration of the controls, and a pop-up transparent GUI makes moving between setups real easy.  I found it improved my workflow alot more than the mackie emulation on the BCF. They also have a preset for DAW mixers but at the moment you have to use the page button to go thru mixer banks in sets of  8 much like control universal/BCF etc. Hopefully they will come out with an update soon so that its possible to select mixer banks as presets much like the Jazzmutant Lemur. The best info I could find on the nocturn before I picked one up was the video tutorials on the novation webpage:

    http://www.novationmusic.com/products/midi_control/nocturn/

  • the nocturne doesn´t look bad - especially the price. tim, how do you actually use it?

  • Do you mean, how do I use it with regards VI? I mostly use it to control plugins during mixdown and a few VTSi's, eg volumes and pans in Kontakt and emuX. I havent used it much with VI as I think the Wiimote is better suited. The nocturn is touch sensitive though and there are LED's around the encoders.As I mentioned above if novation could improve the DAW mixer control presets it would be an excellent all round controller.  Iam a stickler for less clutter when working and love having less that can do more ;p I tried using a touch screen to control plugins(cheap 10" screen off ebay)but it doesnt feel the same as a hardware dial or fader. The Almighty mouse and keyboard quickkeys are still the best and most efficient way of working me thinks, and a Wiimote of course thou : )


  • Tim, could you try, if it is possible to automap cc of VIs inside a VE in Logic (or any other sequencer)? That would be a great help for me to decide, if that's the right controller...

  •  fritzflow-Iam afraid I had no luck getting automap to control either VI or VE both GUI's appeared with the automap wrapper but none of the controls would work.  Iam not sure if this is system based(Iam using Cubase on a PC) ,Iam going to mess about with it when I get more time, but I would recommend looking up or e-mailing Novation with regards the Nocturn, with Logic controlling VI.


  •  fritzflow-I e-mailed Novation about VI and nocturn, it turns out I needed to use it in its MIDI client mode.  Once set up it worked fine controlling the VI as a vst in and out of emsemble.


  • Thank you very much for your help Tim. I ordered the controller today. When I get it, I will check out, if you can get feedback on the rotarys from Logic.