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  4. XP Won't see my 4GB?

  • XP Won't see my 4GB?

    E
    E
    Hi All -

    Hope you can help me out with this one:

    I just installed 4GB of ram in an XP Pro SP2 machine. The BIOS sees all 4 GB, but XP only sees 3.0. I've read all over the place about this, including talking to IBM tech support, but nothing seems to answer my question for certain: Can XP use more than 3GB? I've seen, for instance, a post on Dell's website that says, if you have 4 GB installed, you may only see 3.5 in XP, but to lose an entire GB?

    Should I just send one of my pricey ($550) 2GB SO-DIMM sticks back (I'm using 2x2) and go with 1GB (and buy another library?)

    Thanks,

    Eric

    System: IBM ThinkPAd T60p Core Duo 2.5GhZ 4 GB XP Pro SP2.
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    elksman, it is *normal* that XP mostly does not see all 4 GB. reason is the memory management (already by the BIOS) which mapps certain PCI-ressources into the most upper memory region. this is needed, because XP32 bit could not read any addresses above 4 GB,
    but to loose a whole GB is unusual ... my experience is 3,75 GB are available.
    i would not change the 2 GB sticks to 1 GB because you're left with 2 GB in total then (i'd assume this is a dual bus-memory requiring two identical sticks) - try to get support from IBM or a specialist for BIOS settings to reduce the amount of *stolen* RAM
    christian

    edit: any onboard (shared memory) video card could also grab memory ....
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • E
    E
    Thank you Christian -

    Yes - I understand that I should not see the whole 4GB - but I was expecting better, too. What makes me really suspicious is that the number that shows in the System description is 3.00GB exactly. I see a little more in the task manager (3.144) so maybe some tweaking will get me back the rest. My video card is a ATI Mobility Fire GL 5200 - its control panel says it has 512MB of RAM, which is supposed to be ON the card itself, that was my understanding when I bought it (and why it took so long to get the thing, because they were back-ordered). Perhaps it is taking the system memory? The ATI control utility says that it is on the PCI bus...

    Even though the system only shows 3.00 GB in the XP panel, when I run 'system information', I get:

    OS Name Microsoft Windows XP Professional
    Version 5.1.2600 Service Pack 2 Build 2600
    OS Manufacturer Microsoft Corporation
    System Name NEWSTUDIO1
    System Manufacturer LENOVO
    System Model 2623DDU
    System Type X86-based PC
    Processor x86 Family 6 Model 14 Stepping 8 GenuineIntel ~1995 Mhz
    Processor x86 Family 6 Model 14 Stepping 8 GenuineIntel ~1994 Mhz
    BIOS Version/Date LENOVO 79ETC9WW (2.09 ), 12/22/2006
    SMBIOS Version 2.4
    Windows Directory C:\\WINDOWS
    System Directory C:\\WINDOWS\\system32
    Boot Device \\Device\\HarddiskVolume1
    Locale United States
    Hardware Abstraction Layer Version = "5.1.2600.2765 (xpsp.050928-1517)"
    User Name NEWSTUDIO1\\Eric
    Time Zone Pacific Standard Time
    Total Physical Memory 4,096.00 MB
    Available Physical Memory 2.55 GB
    Total Virtual Memory 3.00 GB
    Available Virtual Memory 2.96 GB
    Page File Space 5.88 GB
    Page File C:\\pagefile.sys

    Thoughts anyone?

    I appreciate your help, especially since it is not your job to trouble shoot my XP problems! I'm looking forward to using all of that RAM for instruments!

    Thanks again,

    Eric
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    last edited
    last edited

    @Another User said:

    Total Physical Memory 4,096.00 MB
    Available Physical Memory 2.55 GB
    Total Virtual Memory 3.00 GB
    Available Virtual Memory 2.96 GB
    Page File Space 5.88 GB
    something confuses me with those values ...
    Total Physical Memory 4,096.00 MB - look, XP seems to see it
    Available Physical Memory 2.55 GB - seems you have loaded ~1,5 GB something
    Total Virtual Memory 3.00 GB - confusing, should be physical memory plus pagefile
    Available Virtual Memory 2.96 GB - what the system can use in fact in total, also confusing
    Page File Space 5.88 GB - might originate from a former setting of pagefile-size
    see my specs on an average machine below to compare (note: windows understands virtual memory to be the available memory in total, independant from beeing physical or the pagefile)

    check te following: does your bios show verbose messages during startup (dos-like lines at startup, before grafical surface coming up) - if not, set your BIOS to show then (sometimes needed to disable *show splash screen* which just shows a logo from manufacturer). try to read the lines regarding memory there, but i bet it reports 4 GB
    if not, check your RAM-sticks to sit correctly in the slots and be paired.

    try to disable pagefile at all (note you have to select the line for the disk the pagefile resides on - don't forget to confirm changes with *set*) - write down the values which are mentioned in this dialog before changing them (screenshot would be the best)

    i would need to get on a machine with 4 GB to tell you more details ...
    http://vsl.co.at/upload/users/449/o24_memory.png">
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • E
    E
    Dear Christian -

    Thank you for your extensive reply. I was not able to find a verbose mode, but when I profile the system from within the BIOS configuration utility (holding F1), it clearly shows the 4GB. As for what is taking the remainder of my memory, that is not clear. Summing the memory demands across all processes explains the decrement from the reported 3.1 total physical to the 2.7 available. As for what's happened to the 900MB, I don't know. I am fairly certain that my video card has its own dedicated RAM (hyper ram, 512MB), as it shows up in the Fire GL control panel, with its own clock speed, etc. I still get conflicting reports of the total physical memory from the System Information panel (from the control panel: 3.00 GB exactly), the task manager (3.144), and from the system profiler, which I put in my first reply (4.00GB).

    I think I will try to find a BIOS expert who can help me re-allocate some of the ram? I'm not sure where I would find such an expert! But I will try.

    Best regards,

    Eric
  • S
    S
    Hi Eric
    I had a similar problem and I found a setting in the bios that sorted out
    the problem.

    It was a bios feature called wrap around memory holes that needs to be enabled.
    My mobo is a ASUS and the feature is in the:
    Advanced section->Chipset->Northbridge configuration->Memory config.

    Now it might be named differently for different bios/mobo's - but look for
    something like memory hole, memory leap etc.
  • E
    E
    Hi Sapkiller -

    Thanks for the suggestion - I looked in the BIOS (F1 on start up) and there is no such switch on my system, or anything remotely resembling it.

    I figured out that the video memory was using 512 MB (it has 256mb on board, but takes 256 more) , but when I disabled my Fire GL video card, it had no impact on the reported memory available.

    I don't know how to reconcile the testimony of those in various forums who assert that 3.0 GB is the ceiling with the experiences of others on this forum who report more memory available.

    What is your system, OS, memory, and how much does your system report as available?

    Thanks again,

    Regards,

    Eric
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    you might have additionally an onboard video on your lenovo model which needs to be disabled ... onboard video mostly uses shared memory (takes it from your RAM sticks)
    christian
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • S
    S
    Hi Eric
    I have 2 systems with 4gb:

    1. AMD64 X2 4200+, XP sp2 , Asus motherboard, 4gb Kingston ram,
    reports 3.9 gb avail. to xp
    2. Intel E6200, XP sp2, Asus mobo, 4gb Geil
    reports 3.6gb avail. to XP

    I just saw your reported memory numbers and its a bit weird

    Total Physical Memory 4,096.00 MB
    Available Physical Memory 2.55 GB
    Total Virtual Memory 3.00 GB
    Available Virtual Memory 2.96 GB
    Page File Space 5.88 GB

    Could you post the commit charge ( its on the bottom right of your taskmgr
    performance screen) - without any applications started.
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    btw ... i forgot to post a screenshot of an asus p5wdg2-ws with a simple matrox G550 PCIe videocard
    <a href=http://vsl.co.at/upload/users/449/blacky_memory.png">
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • D
    D
    This is what my computer says with 4gb installed. I wonder if I need to check the bios in my asus motherboard:

    Total Physical Memory 4,096.00 MB
    Available Physical Memory 1.69 GB
    Total Virtual Memory 2.79 GB
    Available Virtual Memory 2.74 GB
    Page File Space 3.92 GB
    Page File C:\\pagefile.sys
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    deswind, IMO this just says you have ~2.3 GB loaded at the time you have read the values, most of it used in kernel memory (my screenshot has been made direct after boot without having done anything).
    if you have not applied the /3GB switch it might be worth to give it a try and see how far you could get then
    christian
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • D
    D
    How could I have loaded 2.3 gb? This is with just XP running and no other programs running?
    I did use the 3gb switch with USERVA=2850

    I must have something else set wrong on my computer. I could not find that memory wrap option discussed above.

    THANKS for any help.
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    deswind - compare my two screenshots. the upper one had a lot of applications loaded (only 124 MB available), the lower one only XP (3,46 GB available)
    physical memory: upper one: 1 GB, lower one: 8 GB (of course XP-32bit only can access 4 GB), yours: 4GB ... so the board is reporting correctly to the operating system
    it must be an XP issue/setting which prevents to access more ... 2 GB memory used for caching video, mapping PCI address space, ect is impossible.
    christian
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • E
    E
    Hey Christian, Bjarne:

    Thanks for the continuing help. My Task Manager reports:

    Phsyical Memory (K)
    Total 3,114,044
    Available 2,528,868
    System Cache 980,676

    Commit Charge (K)
    Total 379,792
    Limit 2,983,252
    Peak 593,872

    Kernel Memory (K)

    Total 117,664
    Paged 53,000
    Nopaged 64,688

    PF Usages hovers at 370MB.

    I've actually contacted a consultant to help me - I'll let everyone know if something of general utility comes from that.

    Best regards,

    Eric
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    just to add: moved the *innards* of a 2 GB pentium shuttle to a 4 GB core 2 duo yesterday and note: 3,4 GB physical memory available.
    unfortunately i didn't have the time to fiddle around with BIOS settings too much (there is an onboard VGA and probably other unneeded stuff as well as a senseless multimedia ATI all in wonder 1900 videocard), but i'm pretty sure the missing RAM is just reserved for some mapped addresses and we could get another 300 - 350 MB available memory with some patience.
    christian
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • S
    S
    HI again
    Just remembered another (rather old) "feature" of some bios versions:
    Shadow ram - if you have this turned on, your graphic card ram will be
    mirror'd into the main ram.

    I'm not at all sure this relates to your case, but it would account for the loss of 512 mb so maybe you should check out the bios?
    Its most likely to be found in the advanced chipset section - memory or graphics.


    oh just on more thing. 370mb commit charge is a bit high for a system just
    after startup. I usually get figures in the 120-170 mb range
  • E
    E
    Hey Folks - I just wanted to say thanks, and to report that my consultant was unable to find a solution. The Lenovo BIOS on my laptop just doesn't allow one to make the kinds of adjustments to the resource settings that would allow me to free up (some) of that extra 1GB of address space.

    Thanks everyone for your help..

    On a happier note, I got FX teleport, and am now squeezing an extra 1.5 GB out of my old Pentium 4 2.5GHZ with 2GB ram! Which gets me thinking..... Old MacDonald had a farm...

    Best regards,

    Eric