Paul Kopf:

My eLicencer key is just fine. I've had it for many years. Only by reading this thread have I become aware of the 'need' to buy a new key every two years. I suppose that will be cheaper than purchasing insurance (finding insurers is VERY diffricult and my insurance broker has given up trying to find a company that will insure the licences). The dongle hardware is worth peanuts of course, by comparison.

So reading this thread has me pondering this whole issue once again.

I read your comment in the thread where you say, "We all hope that we can come up with a better solution with eLicenser/Steinberg, and we rely 100% on their help here." Any updates on this?

What problems do you face with a policy which separates the lost/stolen key issue from the damaged key issue? If I send a damaged key to you and you know that I own that key, why couldn't you simply replace the key for the cost of shipping? I'm not sure why there would be any additional charges. It all seems so unneccesarily arcane and even fussy.

I own a great deal of software of all kinds and many sample libraries. The only company policy that causes considerable worry and stress re significant cost and inconvenience in regarding a key being damaged or lost is VSL. All others seem to be successful in safeguarding their products with lo/no-stress policies for their customers. Am I wrong?

My iLok dongle (for Sibelius and Altiverb) does not work in the same way. At least, no one is suggesting insuring my iLok. I admit, I don't know what their replacement policy is, but no one seems to be worried about it in the same way.

I am a huge VSL fan. I've spent many hours learning to use your software programs and libraries and made considerable investment in VSL products. You have record of my purchases so you know I am a fully vetted customer. I understand that owning a second (backup) key would be very problematic (for VSL). Too many untrustworthy folks would be selling, sharing. It is unfortunate that these practices are so common, but it is useless to bemoan what can't be changed.

Hoping you and the good people at VSL will find a customer friendly solution that respects its clients' investments and, even loyalties.

Paul R

Hi Paul, 

Thanks for your post. We do understand your situation, and we are working on a better solution. 
As soon as such a solution is available, we will inform you.  

Many questions we have discussed in many many threads before, I will try to answer them as clear and short as possible: 

1) If I send a damaged key to you and you know that I own that key, why couldn't you simply replace the key for the cost of shipping?

=> The hardware warranty for the eLicenser key is 2 years.
=> If the key broke without any signs of applied force, the licenses and the key will be replaced for free.

=> If a key that is older than 2 years broke, this hardware warranty does not apply.
=> E..g., your key that contains all your licenses is now 11 years old. Hardware does wear down, when you are taking the key many places more than when it is connected to your computer all the time. 

2) The only company policy that causes considerable worry and stress re significant cost and inconvenience in regarding a key being damaged or lost is VSL. All others seem to be successful in safeguarding their products with lo/no-stress policies for their customers. Am I wrong?

=> I do not know if you are wrong, as I also didn’t read through the license agreements of all sample developers. 
=> Unfortunately eLicenser does not offer a cloud-based solution, but we hope that we can offer a different "safety-net” in the future.

3) My iLok dongle (for Sibelius and Altiverb) does not work in the same way. At least, no one is suggesting insuring my iLok. I admit, I don't know what their replacement policy is, but no one seems to be worried about it in the same way.

=> My advice: Check out the details for iLok and their license protection once again.

 We are aware that this is not an ideal situation, and it takes longer than we hoped to present an alternative to the existing license-model. 

But we are on it, and we are listening. 

Best, 

Paul

I tried many different insurance companies in France, and no one wants to insurance "software" as it is non-physical. And the dongle doesn't count. So traveling is one thing. But getting robbed at home, or even a fire screws everything up.

Can't you make a key that somehow connects to the internet every now and then? Per example:

My key is stolen, and needs to be connected on the internet every two weeks. If not, its blocked.

OR

You can block the key by its ID. I got it stolen, i let you know, and you deactivate the key. And the elicencer software blocks the key. This would be the best solution to avoid pirating a key.

I've had to travel recently with my key, and not reassuring at all. These keys can end up with 15k+ € of software. I cannot believe you cannot find a valid solution to PROTECT your clients.

Hallo bin ganz neu im Forum

und wollte gern wissen ob ich die gleiche dongle

die ich mit Cubase benutze auch VSL benutzen Kann.

Oder muss ein separat dongel Kaufen?

MfG 

Mamo7

@michi said:

We'd prefer to live in a world without product piracy. But as long this isn't the case, we all have to deal with copy protection. We're providing our customers with a safe system, it hasn't been cracked up to now and works offline as well. So, if a key get's lost, everybody who finds this key has unrestricted acces to the licenses. Free replacement licenses would harm our company, we simply can't afford such a solution. We believe, taking care of the key is nothing but self-responsibility. You won't expect any kind of warning if you put 1.000 bucks into your wallet. It's common sense that you won't get the money back if you loose it. To meet uninsured customers half way in lost key matters, we're offering 50% discount for the replacement licenses and a free 48 hours all application license as first, quick help. Regards, Michael Hula VSL Support

Michael,

What happens if my eLicenser fails while it is sitting safely in my studio?

**Leigh

Hi Leigh, 

Please read the previous page of this thread, it is all there. 

Best, 
Paul

@mamo7 said:

Hallo bin ganz neu im Forum

und wollte gern wissen ob ich die gleiche dongle

die ich mit Cubase benutze auch VSL benutzen Kann.

Oder muss ein separat dongel Kaufen?

 

MfG 

Mamo7

Any news on this from VSL? It's been a few months since Paul wrote that they were working on a better solution.

Hi,

Nothing to share with you yet, still working on it!

Best, 
Paul

I agree that this situation about the Vienna Key being such a valuable piece of kit is a problem. If VSL were to offer some kind of insurance or replacement ploicy, then I would buy it. It's a constant worry, thinking that I might lose my key. 

As it happens, today I find that I may have lost my Vienna key. I have prdered 2 replacements, but I hope that I have left it at home somewhere.  I have added up the cost of all the software and instruments I have, and it's more than 3000 euros!! 

I sincerely hope that a solution can be found if I have indeed lost my key. I cannot afford to replace the instruments if not.

I have also lost my key, during a move.  Totalling up what my 50% replacement cost would be now.  Very disappointing.

@Paul said:

Hi,

Nothing to share with you yet, still working on it!

Best, 
Paul

Dear Paul,

could you please give us another update? Another six months passed without any news in this regard. Thank you in advance.

Hello Dominique, 

I'm sorry to keep you waiting, but it only makes sense to announce our solution when everything is ready. 

Thanks for your patience!

Paul

[updated post]

@agitato said:

One question.

Suppose the key is not lost but somehow gets damaged, say by fire, or simply stops working. (USBs do fail eventually, you know...)

I would imagine that atleast in this scenario, VSL can provide a duplicate license on a new key, provided we mail in the old key to show evidence that no one else can use it.

Please tell me this is true. If not, I will stop buying any more VSL products, since this would mean that my investment is tied to a piece of electronic component that is bound to fail sooner or later.

Anand

Sorry, I did find an answer to my question earlier in this thread, but it still is pretty disappointing. So, essentially we need to buy a key every 2 years to stay within the warranty...and all this is only to cover non accidental failure to the dongle.

Sounds pretty arcane to me, if not cruel. My sympathies to the poor folks who lost the key and spent 1000s more. I am puzzled how this is legal and VSL is getting away with it?  Looks like daylight robbery! If I buy a product I must own it without having to pay for it again and again, period. The analogy someone gave with a car is quite apt. 

I have lost keys from other libraries such as EastWest, and all I had to do was buy a new key and they issued a new license number based on the products that I had. That way the old license numbers would become invalid.

Pretty sure something like that can be worked out. Considering that VSL is such an outstanding company and product in EVERY other aspect including customer service,  I am amazed you havent solved this simple issue.

As I thought more about this, another paradox confounds me. I do not understand why the hardware warranty should be linked to the software license? So you say that if we buy a new dongle every 2 years, you can replace with a new one and install the licenses on that provided we send the old one etc.,. Now why should this have anything to do with whether we have a hardware warranty or not? To be more clear, suppose that I did not have the warranty and I my dongle fails, what is preventing you from doing a similar license transfer assuming I pay for a new dongle (given I dont have the warranty)? 

Mysterious logic!

Anand

P.S. Reading Paul's post I do realize you are working on a solution. I am sure you can and will solve this....

Hi Paul,

thank you for answering so quickly. Would it be possible to give at least a rough time frame? What are we looking at? Weeks, months, years? I was hoping a solution could be presented much sooner, but a year in and we are non the wiser. I start wondering if presenting a solution is at all that important to VSL.

Hi Dominique, 

I understand your position, but we have been burned with release dates that didn't work as we expected, so we are now very careful with announcement. Too much disappointment on both sides. 

Best, 
Paul

I want to add my voice to how much I disagree with and hope for alternate solutions here.

Let us sign up for on-line only mode where the software only works when we're signed in (one computer at a time) online!  If not that something must be possible.  This is such an old fashioned policy.  It seems crazy to me.

Worse, it feels like Vienna is willing to punish their faithful, honest, paying customers over some vague belief that it'll somehow harm them.  Dishonest people have already and will always crack the software.  How does a policy that punishes your good customers help with that in any way?

To be completely honest, this issue gives me a tummy ache every time I take my Vienna key with me.  Although I love the libraries, I'm so stressed about it all the time, I'm almost to the point of looking for other solutions.  I had planned on purchasing the entire libary, but I work on a Surface Pro 3.  I've lost hardware before.  Losing a computer is bad enough.  Losing thousands of dollars of instruments as well.  Ugh.  Everytime I think about buying more instruments, this is like a brick wall of impending doom for me.

I am not a big fan of the dongle protection in this form either, but I understand the need for protection, and I can live with it. As far as I know eLicenser dongle protection was not cracked to this day.
I use VSL mostly at home to avoid loosing the dongle; this can be very stressful because the lost-policy fee is really high.

I would like it if VSL could get access to Steinberg's recovery thing. I would still avoid loosing my key, but it would be less scary to work on the go or take your key to different workplaces. An online-only mode is not the a solution for me, but I could live with it if the dongle needs internet connection every 30 days or so, so lost or stolen keys can be disabled.