Hello,

Thanks for this warning. I am interested in VEP.

I own elicenser and Cubase Pro. And I am happy, that Steinberg will replace my licenses, when the dongle gets lost, stolen or broken. They register the dongle key and the software license. So when you lose the key, there will be only cancelled the elicencer and you get a new activation code for your software that you can register to a new dongle.

The zero downtime is only a extra benefit. More important is, you do not have to buy the same license twice, if you lose it or it get be stolen. As long as I risk to pay twice in accident case, I guess I will not buy the software.

When Steinberg can do, why can't Vienna ?

I see...

thanks for this honest reply.

@SigiZ58 said:

I own elicenser and Cubase Pro. And I am happy, that Steinberg will replace my licenses, when the dongle gets lost, stolen or broken. They register the dongle key and the software license. So when you lose the key, there will be only cancelled the elicencer and you get a new activation code for your software that you can register to a new dongle.

If you purchase a new dongle every two years and transfer your licenses to the new dongle then malfunctions should be covered.  Just send the bad dongle in and ask for some demo licenses to keep you going until they can get things sorted out.  Only malfunctions will be covered, not lost or stolen, and you better believe that they are going to scrutinize that bad dongle to be sure that it didn't malfunction due to negligence on your part i.e. you used it to scrape ice off your car windshield on a cold morning, chew toy for the puppies, etc.

All the veteran forumites know that this is a real sore subject around here (search the forum for more details).  So the best way to keep yourself covered is to buy a new dongle every two years and transfer the licenses then think about getting some insurance (again, search the forum for more details) depending on how much you have invested in this.  Nuff said!

@jasensmith said:

If you purchase a new dongle every two years and transfer your licenses to the new dongle then malfunctions should be covered.  Just send the bad dongle in and ask for some demo licenses to keep you going until they can get things sorted out.  Only malfunctions will be covered, not lost or stolen, and you better believe that they are going to scrutinize that bad dongle to be sure that it didn't malfunction due to negligence on your part i.e. you used it to scrape ice off your car windshield on a cold morning, chew toy for the puppies, etc.

All the veteran forumites know that this is a real sore subject around here (search the forum for more details).  So the best way to keep yourself covered is to buy a new dongle every two years and transfer the licenses then think about getting some insurance (again, search the forum for more details) depending on how much you have invested in this.  Nuff said!

Hi,

 do not know, where you live, but in Europe here (Germany, Switzerland) such insurances do not exist. Not for software licenses. But I would not do that, in any case. 

 Of course I have always several spare e-licensers 😊 I am a bit on the careful side, even I never had any problems until now -knock-knock-knock-,

Independent from that, Steinberg in Europe replaces licenses on broken, stolen or lost e-licencers.

Have a look here if you do not believe.:

http://www.steinberg.net/de/support/steinbergzerodowntime.html

Requirement is only that you have to register your elicensere there. And of course, this should not happen too frequently. But it is simple.  First you get temporary licenses, then they blacklist the broken/stolen/lost elicenser, finally you get new activation keys for your licenses and voila.

Have a nice day.

@jasensmith said:

If you purchase a new dongle every two years and transfer your licenses to the new dongle then malfunctions should be covered.  Just send the bad dongle in and ask for some demo licenses to keep you going until they can get things sorted out.  Only malfunctions will be covered, not lost or stolen, and you better believe that they are going to scrutinize that bad dongle to be sure that it didn't malfunction due to negligence on your part i.e. you used it to scrape ice off your car windshield on a cold morning, chew toy for the puppies, etc.

All the veteran forumites know that this is a real sore subject around here (search the forum for more details).  So the best way to keep yourself covered is to buy a new dongle every two years and transfer the licenses then think about getting some insurance (again, search the forum for more details) depending on how much you have invested in this.  Nuff said!

Hi,

 do not know, where you live, but in Europe here (Germany, Switzerland) such insurances do not exist. Not for software licenses. But I would not do that, in any case. 

 Of course I have always several spare e-licensers 😊 I am a bit on the careful side, even I never had any problems until now -knock-knock-knock-,

Independent from that, Steinberg in Europe replaces licenses on broken, stolen or lost e-licencers.

Have a look here if you do not believe.:

http://www.steinberg.net/de/support/steinbergzerodowntime.html

Requirement is only that you have to register your elicensere there. And of course, this should not happen too frequently. But it is simple.  First you get temporary licenses, then they blacklist the broken/stolen/lost elicenser, finally you get new activation keys for your licenses and voila.

Have a nice day.

I have read through and it looks like Steinberg will only replace their own licences, not other companies'.

"Replacements for licenses from other companies that were also stored on the defective/lost/stolen USB-eLicenser are provided directly from the corresponding manufacturer."

Which I interpret as meaning you would still have to pay 50% of all the licences you owned already.

The whole thing stinks to be honest and if this happened/happens to me, I will leave VSL behind and opt for EW composer cloud, Orchestral Tools or Spitfire.

That is coming from someone who owns about 90% of VSL's products.

Most of the other prominent sample devs don't hinge composers' livelyhoods on a tiny piece of plastic. Maybe VSL should wake up to 2016.

Hello VSL

Is it possible that you send us a warning when we are approaching the 2 year delay.

Can you improve the License transfer for one dongle to another ? so we lauch it and it does it automaticaly.

It will be great if you could add the possibility to have a tour or a holiday license that we can put on a second dongle. 
A user will go on your site, define the tour or holiday period and update the “tour” dongle. When in holiday or on tour the Master dongle cannot be used

Thanks in advance

Best

Cyril

So I went shopping around for insurance options for my eLicencer and VSL software. So far I have been turned away from 2 insurance companies.

Seriously.

I have contact more than a dozen of companies in France, in Germany and in England same result they only insure the value of the dongle not VSL licenses

Who has a name ?

I wanted to take my VSL lib on holiday to work on a few pieces, after thinking a little bit I renounce. Imagine if my dongle is stolen !

So I have prepare the orchestration using EXS24 ! :(

I am another user who lost his dongle. I want to say that ALL the other companies I use were sympathetic and I have my licences restored. I also wrote in and then was  told I was to be charged 50% to cover 'costs', I do not think this is acceptable that such an innovative company should behave this way. When I objected Vienna simply dropped communication with me.  For some reason, when changing motherbards I have East West licences disappear too. They performed a few checks on me and replaced without a grumble. On another occassion Native Instruments licence for part of Kontakt disappeared - one phone call sorted this out. Spectrasonics licences also disappeared during a rebuild - they were also restored.

I want Vienna to know that your products are very good but also very expensive (overpriced  IMO) you leave a very nasty taste in your customers mouth when you behave in this way. Although I do like the quality of your products, would it not be better to spend my money on HollyWood or any other library of which there are now many, if I had the money to spend on 'restoring' my licence?

I just bought a lot of orchestral packages and my main reason for not buying VSL was because opf their customer service on this matter. Many professionals work in environments where a dongle can be stolen or fo missing. Other substaintial companies don't use them - Spectrasonics, Native Instruments, Spitfire and more. 

This way if I lost my dongle again, it would not be a show stopper. Basically this is a shameful way to act VSL. There ARE solutions other companies use them. 

Meanwhile I cannot use my product that I  legitimately paid for

Sadly I expect to be ignored on this view no way to treat your legitimate customers

Z

@jasensmith said:

So the best way to keep yourself covered is to buy a new dongle every two years and transfer the licenses then think about getting some insurance (again, search the forum for more details) depending on how much you have invested in this.  Nuff said!

Okay, I guess not😔

As Mr. Hula said, VSL has to pay for those licenses too.  I don't know how much they have to pay but evidently they have to pay enough to charge you 50%.  Yes! it sucks.  But it sucks for everybody.  If you loose your key why should VSL have to pay for all those licenses and if they pay for yours then they have to pay for everybody else too.

Why the other players in this game like Eastwest have more generous terms with these licensing companies I don't know that either. 

Could VSL do more to warn their customers about the consequences of losing a Vienna key?  Maybe so.  I think at least a bright red warning sticker on the box that the key comes in might help.  Admittedly I didn't realize how important that key was until somebody asked about it on the forum one day but I had never dealt with dongles before.

As for insurance, I think the question the insurance companies would ask is are you a professional composer who needs these software products as part of your livelyhood or are you just a hobbyist, a weekend warrior?  If you're a hobbyist then you're a greater risk and I imagine you would have a hard time finding insurance.  But if you run a studio and you need this software to operate your business you might have better luck because you're more likely to take care of it.

As for me, I have a small business and works out of my home so my licenses are semi-insured through my homeowners insurance.  As long as it doesn't leave my home or my studio I'm covered.  If my home is burglarized or the key is lost due to a disaster (fire, flood, etc.) I'm covered.  It went throught the washer and dryer because I left it in my pants pocket, I'm screwed.  I lost it while on vacation, I'm screwed. 

@jasensmith said:

Why the other players in this game like Eastwest have more generous terms with these licensing companies I don't know that either. 

East West uses iLok, which has another system. However, you also can't sell EW products, so they are not as generous as VSL on that one. The other mentioned products use Kontakt, which doesn't use a dongle, but again you can't sell them.

DG

VSL sell products of highest quality and worth to pay high prices for. So we did that already.

But....

Thinking what we have invested it seems to me pretty inapropriate, that VSL has not covered at all  the Question, how Licenses could be saved, when  dongles break or ar lost.

If Steinberg is able to keep Licenses restorable, (while their Products are much less expensive) than it should be able that VSL come to an  agreement with Steinberg or their eLicenser System to make the same service also available for VSL-Customers.

If wee compare with  the way Native-Instuments handle not only their own productlicening but at the same time the Licenses of douzens of other Products running on Kontakt, I can not imagine that there really should be no way to get the same options to restor VSL-Licenses as it is already possible for Steinberg-Licenses.

(BTW: My Steinberg Account even show my License of a Fable Sound Product which was running on a Halionplayer some years ago. So come on VSL: get in touch with Steinberg! Your customers pay enogh that they deserve a save liceningsystem.)

I think VSL defenitly has to do somthing in this question.

@fahl5 said:

Thinking what we have invested it seems to me pretty inapropriate, that VSL has not covered at all  the Question, how Licenses could be saved, when  dongles break or ar lost.

I don't think the problem is saving the licenses. The way I understand it is if you loose your dongle then whole new licenses have to be issued which is why it costs VSL money.  Maybe I'm wrong?

What's to stop me from telling Vienna that I lost my dongle, when I really didn't, and I need a new one with my licenses restored then turning around and selling that new one to somebody else and letting them download the software from my user area? 

Well, paying 50% of the cost of the licenses is a pretty big deterrent.

As for a dongle breaking, again, if it malfunctions due to no fault of your own and you're within that two year period then that's on Vienna for selling you a faulty dongle right?

@jasensmith said:

I don't think the problem is saving the licenses. The way I understand it is if you loose your dongle then whole new licenses have to be issued which is why it costs VSL money.  Maybe I'm wrong?

What's to stop me from telling Vienna that I lost my dongle, when I really didn't, and I need a new one with my licenses restored then turning around and selling that new one to somebody else and letting them download the software from my user area? 

Well, paying 50% of the cost of the licenses is a pretty big deterrent.

As for a dongle breaking, again, if it malfunctions due to no fault of your own and you're within that two year period then that's on Vienna for selling you a faulty dongle right?

VSL could use an in house system and then not get charged by Steinberg

VSL could make an arrangement with Steinberg to cover these issues

VSL could put in steps to verify the identity of the user when re-issueing licences (like other companies do) therefore ther is no need to levy a 50% detterent

 Legitimate customers that get offered this amazing half price  penalty offer may well just go and buy libraries from other companies instead - loosing VSL customer base. They will understandably be reluctant to buy further packages after being stung this way. NO other company has this sharp practice.

The two year thing for dongles is also wrong, wrong, wrong. 

How many of VSL's customer base are really that shady? I doubt most serious composers would want some random (or friend) to have access to their user area (passwords etc) and use their licences so that seems utterly ridiculous.

The worst part is, the more products you buy from VSL; the more loyal a customer you are, the more you have to lose if something goes wrong. How sad is that?

@jasensmith said:

I don't think the problem is saving the licenses. The way I understand it is if you loose your dongle then whole new licenses have to be issued which is why it costs VSL money.  Maybe I'm wrong?

What's to stop me from telling Vienna that I lost my dongle, when I really didn't, and I need a new one with my licenses restored then turning around and selling that new one to somebody else and letting them download the software from my user area? 

Well, paying 50% of the cost of the licenses is a pretty big deterrent.

As for a dongle breaking, again, if it malfunctions due to no fault of your own and you're within that two year period then that's on Vienna for selling you a faulty dongle right?

VSL could use an in house system and then not get charged by Steinberg

VSL could make an arrangement with Steinberg to cover these issues

VSL could put in steps to verify the identity of the user when re-issueing licences (like other companies do) therefore ther is no need to levy a 50% detterent

 Legitimate customers that get offered this amazing half price  penalty offer may well just go and buy libraries from other companies instead - loosing VSL customer base. They will understandably be reluctant to buy further packages after being stung this way. NO other company has this sharp practice.

The two year thing for dongles is also wrong, wrong, wrong. 

I think most of these ideas have already been proposed before (do a forum search if you're interested)  The last time, I actrually suggested Vienna use a cloud system where you just stream your ligitimately purchased samples and do away with the dongle all together.  Needless to say that went over like a clay pigeon.  However I hear Eastwest has a system like that.

Somebody else had also suggested that VSL get into the insurance business and offer users peace of mind for a nominal monthly fee.  And here's how that went over... 😃😃😃😃😃😃😃 ROTFL.

I don't mean to sound insensitive ZeroZero I actually sympathize with you.  I mean I know I would be devestated if I lost my dongle but knowing what I know now I do everything in my power to the point of ridiculous to prevent that from happening. 

"How many of VSL's customer base are really that shady? I doubt most serious composers would want some random (or friend) to have access to their user area (passwords etc) and use their licences so that seems utterly ridiculous." - simon hanna

Do you have any concept of how much thievery goes on with music and the internet - let alone samples?  It has destroyed the recorded music industry.  There is no industry now.  Anything on the internet is ripped off on a regular basis. 

I would like the hostile, adversarial posters of this, and many other similar threads, to do one thing - tell how they would deal with stolen/lost licenses.  In detail.  To rule out theft on a regular basis.  The fact is, there is no way to distinguish between someone who has lost - or had stolen - a dongle, and someone who just wants another license for free.  If your dongle is stolen - you are screwed.   It is the same thing as if you bought some stuff at a store, and somebody stole it - would you then go to the store and demand your money back?  Then be outraged when you didn't get 100% back?  They would laugh you out of the store.  But that is EXACTLY what you are doing right here.  

The people who write these threads need to come to a basic realization: many people are thieves, and they cause the problems.  Not the people who have goods that are stolen - which these posters are blaming.

@Simon Hanna said:

How many of VSL's customer base are really that shady? I doubt most serious composers would want some random (or friend) to have access to their user area (passwords etc) and use their licences so that seems utterly ridiculous.

The worst part is, the more products you buy from VSL; the more loyal a customer you are, the more you have to lose if something goes wrong. How sad is that?

Not that I would do it but what do I have to loose if I give somebody access to my user area? 

It's not the VSL customer base you have to worry about Simon, it's the piece of excrement thief and/or software pirate you have to worry about.  They can register as a user just like you and they can purchase products and download demo licenses just like you.  From VSL's point of view the risk is just too great to trust that we're all just a bunch of swell guys who would never engage in any improprieties.

Not to mention that, on occasion, a composer might want to "help a brother out."  Afterall, as somebody earlier said VSL is just too overpriced.  Temptation, temptation temptation.