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  4. VSL Saxophones
  • S
    S

    I think Guy's 'Noire' demo is the best I've heard---which is why I wanted the MIDI for it to learn from and build on. I am working on some (hopefully) 'jazzy' things with the Tenor Sax I just got which will require exactly the  articulations you asked about... I will report back with my progress.

    ---JC
  • clruweC
    clruweC
    Cool! I appreciate it!
  • M
    M

    Here's a pretty strident jazz piece I attempted with the Vienna tenor sax about two years ago. It may prove useful to contrast it to other styles of music in which the Vienna sax is used.

    [URL=http://www.planetcanadice.com/Music/BugMDrost.mp3]Bug[/URL]

    I think the vienna saxes are really hard to work with. I'll rework this piece sometime when my head is back into it.

    Another piece that may be more revealing:

    [URL=http://www.planetcanadice.com/Music/SeekingMDrost.mp3]Seeking[/URL]

    Marko
  • G
    G

    You could always check out "Take Five", although I had done that a long time ago, I think I could do it much better today, but still, not too bad.
  • clruweC
    clruweC
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    @Marko said:

    Here's a pretty strident jazz piece I attempted with the Vienna tenor sax about two years ago. It may prove useful to contrast it to other styles of music in which the Vienna sax is used.

    Bug

    I think the vienna saxes are really hard to work with. I'll rework this piece sometime when my head is back into it.

    Another piece that may be more revealing:

    Oh yeah! Fantastic piece of music man! Still not very convinced about the sax though... When playing legato it sounds like there's two saxophones. This could be an issue of sustain (polyphonic) versus legato (mono). But this piece should definitely be one of the demos, vsl should buy it off you, it's really, really good!
  • clruweC
    clruweC
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    @Guy Bacos said:

    You could always check out "Take Five", although I had done that a long time ago, I think I could do it much better today, but still, not too bad.
    Hello Guy, thank you for taking the time to reply. I have checked all the demos out, many times and in detail. I agree that Take five is amongst the best of the lot, however. I still have issues, particularly with the dynamics. They seem very unstable and jumpy (for the lack of a better word). Meaning, the transitions between say p and mf is not very smooth. All the vsl woodwind (and brass) have a beautiful transition between dynamics via the Velocity XF, the saxophones however are terrible. You are probably the ideal person to ask: is this just an issue with the VSL extended version? Is the full library better in terms of smooth transition between dynamics? And finally, are the tenors and altos able to do subtones? Thank you for your time!
  • M
    M

    As for your last question (subtone):

    I am a professional saxophone player, and I consider the VSL sax-samples (I only have the ones from the Special Edition) as following:

    There are 3 velocity layers in almost all patches, even in the legato (exept for bari, there are two), which is unusual for legato patches.

    The lowest velocity is subtone, the second one is regular sound, and the loudest is espressivo. So when changing (or crossfading) from one velocity to another you completely change the way of playing. A solution could be to "scale" the velocity of just one vel-zone. If you like to use only the subtones, just don't go over vel55 and use either the expression cc to control the volume, or expand the dynamic range with a plug in.

    But I second that the VSL saxophones aren't meant for jazz ...
  • clruweC
    clruweC
    Wow! That is actually very good. I hadn't thought of it. And it sits beautifully in the mix. After all I have the broadway big band playing first alto and tenor, so VSL in second gives me a really good ensemble sound, it's perfect! Thank you! So one question: how can I delete the loudest layer from the instrument? (in VI pro). Meaning, how can I set it so that the loudest is actually the second one (regular sound according to you). I tried moving the velocity line in the control window, but that still has espressivo as the fff. I appreciate your help! And thanks again for the tip! C. PS: And of course it would be nice to hear from someone if these velocity-layer issues are still present in the full library i.e. does the Bari still contain only two or is it a limitation of the Special Edition?
  • M
    M

    I dunno if there's an option for that in VIP. I would do that in my DAW. In Logic I could eather set a velocity range for the whole track, or do it after playing in the transform window, similar things should be possible in every state of the art DAW.

    Post your results so we can hear how it blends!
  • clruweC
    clruweC
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    @Another User said:

    Post your results so we can hear how it blends!
    Will do!
  • M
    M

    It might be possible to edit the Sibelius Sound Sets for VSL, if you can't define a range that must not be exceeded, you could at least "program around" a little, for instance define a velocity of 100 for ff, 90 for f, 55 for pp, so that the general volume does not exceed a certain threshold, leave some headroom, so that you can still use accents, which you would set to add 8 to the velocity, making the loudest possible velocity 108 (the last value of the mid-layer).

    You should post directly in the "Notation Programs and Vienna" section of the forum; I am sure andi will help you out.

    MM
  • D
    D

    Hello, Marko.

    I think you made the sax sound very authentic!  I remember some of the good jazz players that were doing this kind of playing, and you made it work well.