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    @mverta said:

     

     

    You assume I don't have a life-long love of Hermann's work; that I don't listen daily - almost obsessively - to Hermann film scores.  And you know what they say about assumptions 😊 😊  

     

    Truth is, some day I'm going to get a chance to use all the cluster tricks I've learned and then you'll be sorry.  😊

     

    By the way, at a concert dedicated to Williams and Hermann film music (conducted by Williams and hosted by Spielberg and Scorcese), Hermann's stuff sounded better live than Williams' did.  Just an interesting little tidbit there...

     

    _Mike

     

     



    Heheh - in that case I'm hoping to become your biggest fan. Herrmann couldn't do the Williams thing and visa versa - it's just the way the score cards fall. These guys know their strengths - that's why they're the best in the business.

    Oh Yes - I'll be sorry alright. Clusters - we had some fun recently with clusters and scoring them out for an orchestra in the USA. The loudness of them is frightening when you're not ready for it. But Herrmann was a bit more than clusters of course.

    I would very much like to hear you do a Herrmann style piece Mike - say about 30 seconds to a minute long - that would be a lot of fun. In fact, VSL should do a competition asking for specific styles just for the hell of it. Short pieces so it's not too taxing on the time element.
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    Although I'd have my own curiosity on this and it can be something fun, this isn't the healthiest to do music to me, Hermann has been done by Hermann and Williams by Williams. I'd rather hear Mike do Mike, a more interesting and bigger challenge.
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    WoW! That has to be one of the most realistic renderings I've heard of sample libraries. It's terrific orchestration no doubt .. but the room sound is what's selling it for me. I wouldn't know where to begin with such arrangements :P, perhaps it just takes time. Damned nice job .. can I play this on the VSL podcast show?
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    @mverta said:

    I have 6 instances of Altiverb running, one for each section, with an additional for Percussion. My first instinct was to use the same profile room for each section but time and time again I found that mixing different profiles seemed to yield results more like what I had on live sessions.  Currently, my Woodwinds use the Trackdown Scoring Stage, my Horns and Brass use the Brugge Concertgebouw, one of my Percussion uses the Sydney Opera house, and one of them uses Trackdown.

     

    Which IR's are you using on the string sections. And an you post pics of your Altiverb settings .. I'd love to try these out. . TODD -AO is a nice room but I'm having trouble getting it to sound lke a nice good room .. can get it to sound real .. but not good real :P
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    Nothing special, really...

    [img]http://www.mikeverta.com/Posts/Strings_Verb.png[/img]
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    Oooh . please post them all :P Thanks for this one though
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    I can post them, but you have to understand that my room and settings choices are dependent upon a lot of things, most importantly the fact that I use different libraries, with different ambiences inherently in the recordings.  I can't use the same room on everything, because not every instrument comes out of the giga with the same default "air" around it; they're not pure, dry samples. I have to compensate for each library's natural quality in various ways to put them all in the same space. So using my settings will not replicate my sound unless you happen to choose the identical instruments, which is highly unlikely, especially given how many blends and custom patches I use.

    _Mike

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    Hmm fair point. Well I use a blend of EW, VSL (Legacy) VSL VI, SAM and EXS Instruments. Though I prefer using VSL for everything since it works very well for me .. the only problem I have is that the Special edition has some articulation limitations (HAve to buy the big library to solve that :P), and so I use the Legacy stuff and EW library to make up for the short fall. . Anyways, perhaps then it would be interesting to hear about how you route your reverb. For instance do you use a send / return system on Pre fade, or post fade. YOu mentioned 6 reverbs .. how are they used .. is that 3 depths layers with left and right or some other kind of layering. Sorry to be so curious but you have a terrific sound and I'd love to get a similar size and depth to my own recordings. (Role on MIR).
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    Here, I just banged on each section of the orchestra, and let each one tail out so you can hear the room/reverb/placement if you want to try and match it.

    [url=http://www.mikeverta.com/Posts/Orchestra_Test.mp3]Orchestra Test[/url]

    _Mike

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    Incredible work. The brass is especially great. Didn't you post "Ewok Battle" a while back? 

    Can you talk about how you get the runs using SI string samples? I've never been able to get that. Are you just using the staccatos? 

    Thanks for the mix tips, you have a very nice soundscape there. 
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    I posted the Ewok Battle a while, while, while ago, yes.  I was extremely unhappy with the sound I was getting, and set about starting over after that.

    For runs, I never use staccatos, I use legato violins (3 layers with MW control, AA) and sometimes layered with Legato AA R.

    They're usually carefully measured runs, so I'll often play them in in step mode.  

    Thanks for the kind words!

    _Mike
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    Sounds Great !!!
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    Mike, This is a great arrangement. I understand being inspired by Goldsmith/Williams and the like, but for me you've also put a very unique stamp on this theme. It makes me want to hear more of your original material. Colin
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    All I say is wow!!! What a great soundscape.

    Thanks for all the insight and explanation.

    Actually you made me review my template again!! ;)
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    Mike...this is a great mock-up...... Great achievement. It just goes to show how working a template over time (years) is the only way to get there...very REAL. Question. Your "master-verb": The fake one you add, after the room........Which preset on Lexi 300? Are the er's turned OFF on this verb? Do you exxagerate the pre-delay so it doe s not get in the way of the room ER's?......How long is that taIl from the 300? thanx for sharing and "setting the bar" ;-) best, SvK
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    I use a custom patch, which was just a tweak of the default, actually.  It's a 3-second reverb with some of the lows and low-mids rolled back so it doesn't get muddy.  I kill the pre-delay, because that just adds more "room" and I've already got that covered.  This reverb is just for the "wet."  There are differing levels of send to the master verb per section via an aux bus.

    Thanks for the kind words, guys.  I'm truly glad you enjoy the work!

    _Mike

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    Great thread and awesome realism on this mock-up Mike.   SvK - I have horsed around with this using my Wizoo w2 (HDIR Concert) ir on a seperate FX bus.   I seem to get pretty good results using about a 50-60 predelay to get out of the way of the beautiful Todd AO room ( I know you use as well).

    I haven't yet worked on the lows and mid-lows on the w2 'master overall verb' but I think it a good idea and would be applicable on most material.   My gut is saying the 225-300 range is going to need some cut.  I'll try to report back what works here.

    Rob 
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    Mike and SvK - I just ran an experiment with the piece I wrote for the VSL brass library last year - using this concept of a 'master verb' over the AV6 Todd AO room.   I must say I really like it.   I also used the 'wide' mics and think that gives some nice space around the samples.

    BTW - I rolled off the low and mids on the 'master bus' verb and it reduces the mud quite a bit.  This of course will be material dependent but I am liking the results.   I think I could reduce these freqs and tad more on the master verb and still be good - perhaps better.   There is plenty of 'warmth' coming from the Todd AO buses. 

    What do you think?

    http://www.robelliottmusic.com/mp3s/Americana/Journey%20to%20Greatness%20(Joseph's%20Theme)_wide%20mics.mp3

    Rob 
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    Hi Tanuj,

    I know what you mean about Todd AO and the big busy stuff.   Most of what I have been doing of late has been small, romantic, etc. and I couldn't ask for a better sound.   Having said that I still feel - with some tweaking and balance of ER and tail, eq - that we can get there with it on the big stuff.

    Do a search here for SvK's approach to using AV6 (seperating ER and Tail on seperate busses - for flexibility and control).   I think it is the way to go.

    I took an hour and put together this little diddy - made it busy (and rather lame [:P])- to show how with only sliding down the tail busses a tad and overall Wizoo verb slider much more (everything inlcuding eq being the same) - I get close to a final mix  (these are the same exact IR and settings as the piece above).  Of course from here careful attention to Eq, etc. will be key.  I have purpose 'layered in' more on each sussequent phrase to hear the build up of notes has on the overall mix.

    Again look for Savkampen's post on setting up AV - Good luck.  This business of mixing is for sure a lifetime pursuit.   I have really appreciated the kind folks on this board that have been so open to sharing their knowledge and experience.

    http://www.robelliottmusic.com/mp3s/Misc/Skitzoid%20strut.mp3
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    Maybe it would be a good idea to move experiments to another thread so your tests don't get lost in this discussion...

    _Mike