@Christian Marcussen said:

I'm just amazed how people go all nuts and worship evan becuase of his father - even when hes completely obnoxious.

People have insulted me first here. And I am not a coward. If you wanna attack me I WILL defend myself. That can look obnoxious, but those who are closer to me, who really see what's going on see it as valiant. It's no fun watching a fight. But I am not gonna let someone roll over me.

I criticized VSL early on, in a manner which was respectful and constructive. It was met straight by Herb with a defensive attack on me. His reaction was completely unprofessional, lacked tact, and had bad corporate strategy. The correct response would have been "thank you for your input/comments, we will keep them on file and consider them in future updates." Done. That's all it would have taken.

Herb responded in ill form, so I told him he was way off base to treat a customer who just spent thousands of dollars to purchase his product should not be treated like they were being talked to by a **insert name of a choice here**. So I was banned. For trying to help VSL, and telling them they could improve how they run their company.

Evan Evans

Well.

I too have been critical of some of VSL's moves and have stated so openly on many occations (just as I have praised VSL for all the stuff they do right). I too have also given loads of suggestions to how they can improve their products and their company. However I doubt anyone has considered banning me - makes you think.

In other words it's not what you say, but how you say it. Perhaps once or twice you might have given some constructive and decent critique - but most of your posts come off as arogant, selfcentered, condecending, ill mannered and out of this world. Not the best way to get taken seriously.

@Christian Marcussen said:

Well.

I too have been critical of some of VSL's moves and have stated so openly on many occations (just as I have praised VSL for all the stuff they do right). I too have also given loads of suggestions to how they can improve their products and their company. However I doubt anyone has considered banning me - makes you think.

In other words it's not what you say, but how you say it. Perhaps once or twice you might have given some constructive and decent critique - but most of your posts come off as arogant, selfcentered, condecending, ill mannered and out of this world. Not the best way to get taken seriously.

Yeah but the talent is out there. The greatest minds know how to learn from them. Criticizing someone who criticizes you is not going to get anyone very far. And I wouldn't criticize VSL for what they did if it wasn't a corporation, a company with a fleet of users that deserve to be treated better than people who bought their product and have a message board.

Whatever. Like I've said before, it doesn't reflect on my feelings for any of the individuals at VSL, such as Herb et al, it's a problem I have with their corporate policy on how they treat those customers who are critical of them, whether constructive, arrogant, condescending, etc., or not.

Evan Evans

As one of the people who did demos here I have to defend the other composer/performers, and say that the work of many of them, including Jay Bacall, Christian Kardeis, Bill Brown, Beat Kaufman, and the "Liszt of the Sampler" Guy Bacos, are fabulous and impressive both as demos and as music. And there are many others that are fantastic also. Just go through the demo section and you will be amazed...

Alright, William. I will give it all another shot. Thanks. Respect your opinion.

Talk to you soon,
Evan

Sure a company must listen to their clients.
Sure they have to understand we, the clients, are their best assets.
Sure we should give them some comments to make a better product.

But I certainly don't expect anything in return from the company.

If they answer me by saying they took good notes about what I said, I'll be impressed but unfortunately most of the time it doesn't happen.

I'm not saying that's a good thing. It's just how business works.

Companies would get much better by listening and reacting with their customers.

I believe the Vienna Team is doing a pretty good job on this.
They're part of the forum; they take the time to answer questions that have been asked a zillion times.

For sure things can be improved; it just takes time.

Blaming somebody, making somebody angry, yelling at a company that x feature or y feature is not available won't do anything.

You're complaining about the quality of the demos?
If they were none, you'd complain there's no demo.

If you really feel those demos are crap, make your own and send them to VSL.
It's opened to everybody.

But maybe you're so busy that you can only talk about how bad demos are.

Excuse me sir, but if we're looking at your website and your credits and we compare with other composers who submitted demos, I believe there is no comparison.

Now you may argue that art is not based on credits and only with music.
Then do so!

I'd love to hear how the VSL will sound with the best composer/producer/arranger/orchestrator/developer/programmer on earth.

Vincent

Vincent,

I had enough time, that I could briefly let VSL know that the demos representing their new product line were unflattering. I did so, as I have done before, so that they could review their quality control line and see if any constructive changes need to be made.

Also, I never blamed anybody about anything. There was no blaming. It was all constructive illumination, poorly reacted to, without professional diplomacy. I criticize that they behaved that way as well. I really like Herb and most of his team. Every criticism is a reflection of the consumer that the company should be aware of. It's not the companies place to correct, or make public judgements of their customers criticisms of their company. The money goes to the company and the company humbly accepts it and trades it for a piece of what they are best at. It doesn't go the other way. This is why they have certain boundaries, and we do not. It's just good business.

And Vincent, I don't appreciate you guessing at what you think I am like or have done. That shows blinded loyalism. You probably don't want to be biased. It's not going to let you make the best decisions in the future. Anyway, thanks for the input, they are good points.

Evan Evans

What sort of person is unimaginative enough to have the same initials for both first and last name anyway?

Chris C

........oh..............er...............!!!!! [:O]ops:

Hi Evan,

I agree with you when you say that companies should be aware of their clients and be opened to any suggestions. That's what most companies lack of. The more they listen the better they will be, especially for software companies.

I'm just saying that even though VSL can still improve (like anybody in that matter), they do a better job than most of their competitors.

Sure they can improve and they will hopefully.

A few things that quickly come in my mind:
- updated and official tested systems we can use. I know we can find some in the forums but it'd be nice to see it clearly somewhere with real live setups for each situation (not 20 but 4,5)
- a troubleshooting section that gathers the FAQ questions we find in the forums. That will save us and them so much time.

Things come with time, we'll see.

By the way, I just wanted to point out that I haven't been able to listen to what you did with the VSL as opposed to other composers that posted their works here.

Since I'm a curious person, I checked your website the same way I did for the other composers. I have no doubts you're a talented person. Music is so subjective anyway.

You just need to admit you may not have as many credits/experience than other composers have. That doesn't make you weaker or not as good.

If you really want to make a point here, post some music that blows us away.

I think everybody will agree with this statement: we all want to make the VSL sound as good as we can. Listening to great cues/mixes inspire us.

So go ahead [:)]

Vincent

@vinco said:

If you really want to make a point here, post some music that blows us away.

Vincent

Bis

@Another User said:

If you really want to make a point here, post some music that blows us away. ... So go ahead [:)]
Vincent

I don't have the time to do that. Those who know me, and have listened to my tracks communicating directly with me, know I am the litmus test for what sounds good. I am blessed with excellent ears. Ears that agree with consensus. I've learned to trust them, and other's can trust me.

I know there are some very old one's of mine here, using just VSL First Edition with no performance instruments/tools. I will try and find something and email it to Herb to put on the site. Something newer with a lot of range. But when I have time to do so. I'm working on a film right now, and got another one coming. Each one bigger, and better than the last. TIP: That doesn't happen if you are only adequate.

[;)]

Evan Evans

If you really want to hear what Evan can do listen to the stuff he did with 1 akai and a kurzweil. [;)]

Why do self-concious and obnoxious egos always quote themselves in their profiles on internet forums?

It's like a rule of thumb.

Ahah yeah !

I think Evan is a nice person but a little bit of an egocentric person. I don't mean it as an insult, that's just a fact i noticed.

If you go on IMDB.com and type "evan evans", you'll see that there's a biography. Evan Evans is a good composer ( i listened some of his works ) but not a famous composer, he's not reknown like a A composer yet.
But still he has a biography on his IMDB profile, probably written by himself. Can you believe that ? The guy is 30 years old and already has a biography. Moreover if you go deeper inside his IMDB profile, you can see his "personal quotes" . Who cares ? I mean, ok i'm interested in reading Sean Connery, steven spielberg or stanley kubrick personal quotes. But evan evans one ? who cares ? I'm sure he wrote himself his IMDB profile. Isn't that attitude a bit egocentric ?

Writing "I am a world class film composer. It is not something that is easy to accomplish, nor are some born with the potential" isn't that completely pretentious ?

@Another User said:

Writing "I am a world class film composer. It is not something that is easy to accomplish, nor are some born with the potential" isn't that completely pretentious?

Most of my quotes are meant to be humorous, not pretentious.

P.S. Try to stay on topic dude. Or start a new one for off topic discussion. it's just good netiquette, and I'm sure everyone else would appreciate the effort.

Evan Evans

@Vagn Luv said:

Why do self-concious and obnoxious egos always quote themselves i...?

I feel I have something to say. I will die doing so. Whether in music or philosophy. Should I just work at McDonalds? What did you figure out about mankind and the universe that tells you quoting oneself is disagreeable? Perhaps you are living inside an antiquated set of ego rules. The future is for those with open minds.

Evan Evans

@evanevans said:

I'm working on a film right now, and got another one coming. Each one bigger, and better than the last. TIP: That doesn't happen if you are only adequate.

[;)]

Evan Evans

Oh'come on! [:D]

You may be talented and gifted composer, but you seem to have a hard time getting the point.

It does not matter if your the next John Williams (or even if you ARE John Williams) - your posts still come off as " [8-)] ".

Well the only point I am getting is that you guys care to spend time pointing these character traits out to me. For that, I feel the love, and am grateful. But I still have chosen to be this way. I didn't start out like this. It's a just a part of who I am, have become, and where I came from. It's the Evan Evans' dynamic. Massively confident, to the point of being annoying to some who aren't listening to the deep underlying spring of inspiration. I have 100% convictions about my beliefs. I am proud to have so much passion. Without it I would be just a craftsman.

Evan

LOL, why didn't I come across this guy before? Very entertaining reading [:D]

I'm still waiting for some awesome VSL demos that will blow us all away.....by Mr.....

There's a saying: Put your money where your mouth is.....