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  3. Looped Opus1 perf.leg Violins?

  • Looped Opus1 perf.leg Violins?

    M
    M
    Evening all

    Using Vl 14_perf-leg_p+f_2lay, my legato phrases are all ending shorter than I would like. It appears that my starting notes are all looped, but not the transition/destination notes. I've tried the sustain pedal workaround, but the re-bowing is too obvious.

    Have I done something wrong during my import into HAL format, or is this happening to the Giga users as well?

    Is there some other way to achieve long legato phrasing that can be performed in realtime, using the Legato Tool and the Perf_leg instruments?

    Thanks,
    Mike.
  • E
    E
    Mike,

    Prepare yourself for a little disappointment as you await the official word.

    Evan Evans
  • H
    H
    For Giga (3) and Kontakt we are offering now new mapping versions in our USER AREA. EXS and Halion are coming soon.
    With this new versions it's possible to use longer notes during a legato phase. In a nutshell: you can blend via modwheel-controller always to a sustained note.

    The intervall (legato) samples are shorter than the starting notes (which are normal sustains), because there are 24 intervall samples for each key. It's very time consuming (and exhausting) to sample this legato performances, therefore the length of each note is factor during recording.

    best
    Herb
  • F
    F
    StrĂ¥lande!!! (Brilliant)

    Bengt Nilsson
  • M
    M
    Thank you for the explanation. I look forward to using the new HALion mappings when they become available.

    Regards,
    Mike.
  • E
    E
    Great idea Herb! Simple way to solve the problem and likely just as effective if not more so.

    I will go in and do that to my pro edition samples now myself!

    [;)]

    Not such bad news after all eh Mike?

    Evan Evans
  • M
    M
    [[;)]] Not such bad news Evan - except that we have now lost the use of the mod wheel for things like VI_per.leg f + porta? If it's busy crossfading to the sustained sample, does that mean we lose the original function of switching between straight and porta?

    I've taken the bull by the horns (what the heck, I'm on holiday) and have started lengthening the transition samples myself. It's a huge task but the results so far (two octaves) are stunning: roughly 24 seconds of unlooped magic for each transition interval. I'm crossfading the original 3.5 sec transition sample with its corresponding 20 sec mV_sus sample and saving it, with exactly the same file name that it had before, to a new folder. I then copy it to VSL's folder, overwriting the old one.

    Halion sees the new sample and plays it. Voila!

    Just one hurdle to overcome: the sample is cutting short at the same point of the old sample length (ie. 3.5 sec). If I assign these new samples manually, they play their full length perfectly. So something is "remembering" the old sample length, even though the new sample is now much longer. I was just hoping to avoid having to re-assign each sample manually because of the number of samples that are stacked on each note - it gets VERY dense and tricky.

    I now have a tiny glimpse of the work involved in producing a library the size of VSL - hats off to you guys - an unbelievable achievement!

    Happy New Year,
    Mike.
  • M
    M
    Solved the "cutting off" problem. Turned out to be an "end stop" that had to be shifted so that the sample plays all the way to the end of its new, 20 second length (it was still in the old 3.5 second position). It works beautifully, and no re-programming or mapping required.

    Oh boy - 24 second sustains on my perf_leg Violins! Now for the rest of the Strings....

    Hopefully, this is as easy to do in GS as it is in Halion. Best of luck.

    regards,
    Mike.
  • D
    D
    last edited
    last edited

    @Mike McCarthy said:

    Solved the "cutting off" problem. Turned out to be an "end stop" that had to be shifted so that the sample plays all the way to the end of its new, 20 second length (it was still in the old 3.5 second position). It works beautifully, and no re-programming or mapping required.

    Oh boy - 24 second sustains on my perf_leg Violins! Now for the rest of the Strings....

    Hopefully, this is as easy to do in GS as it is in Halion. Best of luck.

    regards,
    Mike.


    Can you post an example without tweaking, reverb etc. so that we can all hear what you have achieved? I ask, as I've given up on the Performance instruments for much of my current demo as I don't have time to copy and paste every 4th note or so...!

    DG
  • M
    M
    [:)] I'd be happy to, Doug, but you'd have to tell me how to do it! I don't have a website of my own, and I've never posted a demo before.

    Each new, extended transition sample is now approx. 3.5 meg.

    So far I have completed all the full-tone up and full-tone down transition samples. I could do a slow, legato scale with some long pauses on certain notes to show the new lengths. Because of the exquisite consistency of Herb's sampling, the crossfades are transparent - although each one has to be done individually to match vibrato and timbre. Bear in mind that this is a labour of love, and I cannot work on it full-time (I'd love to!) because of family and studio commitments.

    But trust me, the results are so good that I have no qualms about the amount of work involved. The playability is now so intuitive - no crossfading, or distractions. Just play the phrases and the notes sing - no more dying notes. BTW - I am using HALion 2.

    Regards,
    Mike.
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC
    mike, you can email me (or in case its too big i'll send you a login for an ftp) the file and i'll put it on a server to link to.
    there will be an option to upload files to the VSL webserver soon
    christian
    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • E
    E
    Mike,

    Are you certain there is no hope looping those destination legato notes instead of adding to them and creatign more hard disk space room?

    By the way VSL, I am one user who would have gladly have payed extra for longer destination notes, both in hard drive space / raid array and in sheer recording and engineering costs. It is inconvenient right now. However, that is what money is supposed to be for (making things convenient).

    Evan Evans
  • M
    M
    Hi Evan
    You're right - looping is the most economical option - but I tried it and the results were not good.

    The transition samples tend to end before the players settle into any sustained bowing. So there is a distinct "conclusion" feel to these phrases - not ideal looping material, I'm afraid.

    The other factor was time. Looping takes me way longer than simply crossfading two samples. I've got it down to about five minutes per crossfade now. Unfortunately, there is a glitch in every VI_mVsus_f sample that has to be fixed (approx. 2 seconds from the end of the sample) which adds a little more time. Navigating the Austrian-titled folders is another challenge! [[;)]] I shall be fluent by the end of this project.

    Progress so far:
    1 semitone up & down samples: done
    2 semitone up & down samples: done

    Christian: Thanks for your offer. I will email you.

    Thanks for your interest guys, it's encouraging!

    Best wishes,
    Mike.