>>
You are quite correct. This is the bottom line. If you don't want to pay, then don't get VI.

If my clients don't like the fact that I am charging more than I used to, they don't have to get me to work for them.
>>

Well, I did not mean it in this harsh way. VSL job is about business - and from point of marketing - it is much easier to earn money from a satisfied customer than to gain new ones. and there is the rule that one unsatisfied customer has a multiplication rate of about 12.

If your that good DG, that you can easily oversee that, congrats, VSL should maybe not.

I was more meant like - the existing lib is quite great - the new ones have some feature but also we have to give up some features and conveniences.
As I pointed out in other threads I think the licencing format is a step in the wrong direction - for example I bought French Oboe and Epic Horns - if I would want the same stuff with the VI I would have to pay about 3 times the price or even more I think (get Winds X and Brass X standard and the extende versions for the instruments - wow, that is a lot). So I am quite happy I got them a few months ago - no way I would buy them currently and maybe not in the future.

And still I do not have the need for another sample player. Another software to install, another licence to manage. To to mention gigabytes of samples I can only access with one software. How will ist support DP on Mac, or Logic, or this and that software? Makes things more complicated and in return I get some benefits back.

I would be really interested how many customers were gained with the Horizon series. I think the VI will attract a lot less. Horizon offert a wide variety in some boxes (Opus, to lesser Woodwinds) and really on the point with others (French Oboe, Solo Strings, etc.) VI does non of both.

JMO

@steff3 said:

>>

If your that good DG, that you can easily oversee that, congrats, VSL should maybe not.
JMO

I never said that I was any good [[:|]] That certainly is no prerequisite for getting work and/or being paid well. If it was, then Hollywood would have far fewer composers [:D]
DG

[6]
here is good suggestion . GO TO OZ AND GET A BRAIN!
These samples have to be reoptimised and redited to be used as instruments. do you think this is free? Do you think you're entitled to freebies becuase you want something? the VIP upgrade is FAIR. maybe one can argue to take 10-20 points off of the total price but that is determined by the market place. Since it sounds like you won't be making any purchases, thats good for the rest of us maybe we can expect a sale down the road. till then go back to writing loop based noise and go back to the cubase forums!

Mr. mike harper

>>
here is good suggestion . GO TO OZ AND GET A BRAIN! >>

I do not know to whom you are referring, but anyways, this is a personal insult. As the rest of your writing! And it even does not really matter to whom you refer.

This is absolutely ways off! Please go elsewhere to meet people with your discussion culture and habits!

Best

Dear forum members,

may I ask you all to stay polite and friendly. After all, we talk about music and instruments here, and there's no need to get into flame-wars apart from these topics [;)]

Thanks for your understanding.

Mr Mike Harper,

I am quite surprised that your posts are tolerated on such an otherwise elegant forum. The people here are merely giving their reactions in a civilised way, which is their good right.

As for you, I suggest you pay a little visit to Mr Oz yourself, and get yourself at least a small upgrade pack of common decency and basic politeness.

And while your at it: get a brain as well. Only a very ignorant person would mention "loop making noise" and "cubase forums" in one breath.
Everyone else knows steinberg offers excellent software for professional composing and audio editing. A lot more than "noiseloops" has been created on cubase, though probably not by you.


Alex O.

>>
I am quite surprised that your posts are tolerated on such an otherwise elegant forum.
>>

Also wondering about that, as this is not even the only flame he did.

best

I would imagine that users who have made a contribution to the forum in the past might be given a little more rope. However those who join in merely to complain....................

DG

Well,

"giving more rope" and "not intervening personal insult" is quite a bit a difference, at least for me.
Maybe "go and get a brain" is just normal talking in his environment, but this is an international forum... I hardly consider something like that as friendly talking in general.

>>
However those who join in merely to complain....................
>>
One could interpret this in all kinds of ways. I hope you did not mean critically discussing the prodcut policy - because I think a user should be able to do that. This just shows that they care about their relation to the company - for example I never complained about Logic Pro7 (the new features, the missing features) I just did not buy the update.

And I think that VSL can stand a little critics and knows how to interpret them.

best

@steff3 said:

Well,

"giving more rope" and "not intervening personal insult" is quite a bit a difference, at least for me.
Maybe "go and get a brain" is just normal talking in his environment, but this is an international forum... I hardly consider something like that as friendly talking in general.

>>
However those who join in merely to complain....................
>>
One could interpret this in all kinds of ways. I hope you did not mean critically discussing the prodcut policy - because I think a user should be able to do that. This just shows that they care about their relation to the company - for example I never complained about Logic Pro7 (the new features, the missing features) I just did not buy the update.

And I think that VSL can stand a little critics and knows how to interpret them.

best

I have no problem with people criticising a product. I have a small problem with criticising in a thread with this title, as I find it offensive.

DG

>>
have no problem with people criticising a product. I have a small problem with criticising in a thread with this title, as I find it offensive.
>>
Thanks for your answer. There I you right, the title is not the best, but I think the discussion was pretty open and fair.

>>
"not intervening personal insult"
>>
To this I think I have to state that I had a PM with "cm" and he told me his opinion about it and he also expressed his concerns in the other thread. So my statement is pretty much simplified.


I do not know Mr. Harper, cannot state on his contributiions as we are perhaps in different sections of this forum until now. From my first contact I would think it was not the worst thing.

Sorry for putting this further.

best

@DG said:

I have a small problem with criticising in a thread with this title, as I find it offensive.

DG

and the title tends to trigger a flaming tendency in other people.

tele

ok. ok. that was over the top! no offense to anyone. btw i do own cubase!

Well, I can only respect a man who admits a mistake.
And since my reply was at least as "spicy" as yours, I probably could have been a bit wiser myself.
Lots of happy composing in Cubase then, Mike!

Sincerely,

Alex

@DG said:

[quote=steff3]


I have no problem with people criticising a product. I have a small problem with criticising in a thread with this title, as I find it offensive.

DG

True. The word "Scam" is not in place here. The VSL-people don't deserve that.
I still don't understand why the registered owners were not offered converted versions of the samples they already own, to try in the VI. The VI itself should of course come with a price, it is a new product. But with the options ffered now, I feel rather left out.
But that said, it doesn't affect my respect towards the Vienna team.
Not at all.

"We show respect, even if we disagree" (Bowie-"Outside")

Kindly,

Alex