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  • MIDI 2.0

    Are there any plans of supporting MIDI 2.0, especially for the Piano Libraries?

    Logic Pro is supporting it, the MIDI Keyboard Roland A-88 MKII does too.


  • Hi pubear, 

    It's not planned in the near future, as we have to catch up with some other topics.

    But of course we're watching the development!

    Best, 
    Paul


    Paul Kopf Product Manager VSL
  • Hello Paul

    Logic 8 has just been released, you can now select Midi 2 in Logic preferences

    I am trying to import midi Logic files into Dorico, today it is a heavy work, is it going to simplify it ?

    The best result I get is importing XML files but I loose all VI instrument names (do you know a solution to this)

    Kind regards

    Cyril


    MacBook Pro M3 MAX 128 GB 8TB - 2 x 48" - 1 x 27" screen --- Logic Pro --- Mir Pro 3D Dolby Atmos --- Most of the VI libs, a few Synch... libs --- Quite a few Kontakt libs --- CS80 fanatic --- Studio equipped in Dolby Atmos 7.1.2
  • Hi @Cyril Blanc!

    We are not the developers of Dorico, that's a question better asked in the Steinberg forum.


    Ben@VSL | IT & Product Specialist
  • Hi Ben

    I know that you are not a develloper of Dorico, my question is :

    Are VSL Plug-ins going to support Midi 2 ?

    If I have understand, MIDI 2 allows bi-directionnal conversation between the DAW and the plug-in as well as many other feature.

    So if Logic, Dorico, VSL are all compatible MIDI 2 this should improve our workflow

    Today when you import a Logic Midi file into Dorico you lose all the VSL instruments and there setting.

    Did I understant the feature of MIDI 2 badly ?

    Best

    Cyril

    @Ben said:

    Hi @Cyril Blanc!


    We are not the developers of Dorico, that's a question better asked in the Steinberg forum.


    MacBook Pro M3 MAX 128 GB 8TB - 2 x 48" - 1 x 27" screen --- Logic Pro --- Mir Pro 3D Dolby Atmos --- Most of the VI libs, a few Synch... libs --- Quite a few Kontakt libs --- CS80 fanatic --- Studio equipped in Dolby Atmos 7.1.2
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    MIDI 2.0 has Orchestral Articulation Profiles which are sortof like Studio One Sound Variations, but have standard IDs for things like staccato, legato, pizzicato, etc., which should make it possible to use any library that supports the Orchestral Articulation Profiles without having to create expression maps. So, you could use pretty much all articulations in any string or woodwind or brass library in Dorico without any configuration needed.

    These Orchestral Articulation Profiles are still under development, but I'm sure when the spec is finalized, VSL will probably implement it, like they have Sound Variations. It would mean less work for them, since they would no longer need to make "VSL for Dorico", and Cubase expression maps, and the same for other DAWs and notation programs.


  • I think you will find that MIDI 2.0 has been in Logic Pro since 10.7.7.

    @Cyril-Blanc said:

    Hello Paul


    Logic 8 has just been released, you can now select Midi 2 in Logic preferences


    I am trying to import midi Logic files into Dorico, today it is a heavy work, is it going to simplify it ?


    The best result I get is importing XML files but I loose all VI instrument names (do you know a solution to this)


    Kind regards


    Cyril


    Just a beginner
  • it has been advertised only with 10.8, and you have it now in the pref

    @rAC said:

    I think you will find that MIDI 2.0 has been in Logic Pro since 10.7.7.


    @Cyril-Blanc said:

    Hello Paul




    Logic 8 has just been released, you can now select Midi 2 in Logic preferences




    I am trying to import midi Logic files into Dorico, today it is a heavy work, is it going to simplify it ?




    The best result I get is importing XML files but I loose all VI instrument names (do you know a solution to this)




    Kind regards




    Cyril



    MacBook Pro M3 MAX 128 GB 8TB - 2 x 48" - 1 x 27" screen --- Logic Pro --- Mir Pro 3D Dolby Atmos --- Most of the VI libs, a few Synch... libs --- Quite a few Kontakt libs --- CS80 fanatic --- Studio equipped in Dolby Atmos 7.1.2
  • The MIDI 2.0 that is included in these early DAWs is often only really partial or experimental support and not really complete support for MIDI 2.0. Cubase has said they have added support for MIDI 2.0 in the latest version, but it is really just initial support for high definition MIDI CC's (so that you can have up to three decimals after the controller value, ex. 103.267 instead of just 103).

    @rAC said:

    I think you will find that MIDI 2.0 has been in Logic Pro since 10.7.7.


  • Just curious, what's the advantage in this case? Even if the resolution is higher, the piano libraries would still have the same number of dynamic layers. And I suspect that 128 different options of velocity are enough that you won't hear the difference for a higher resolution.


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    i am personally excited about the future of midi 2.0 for a number of reasons. I think it's going to be a very slow and gradual transition and we have to see how it all gets utilized. The daws being able to record midi 2.0 tracks are just a first step, and macOS and windows are also incorporating 2.0 into usb drivers.

    As it picks up steam I'm sure we will see plugins begin to provide 2.0 resolution. Obviously more layers of midi velocity are interesting but it's yet to be seen whether people will actually notice the additional resolution other then very few scenarios. I personally think more cc resolution will be noticeable.

    all the stuff about articulation management may eventually be helpful but vst3, for example, has already abstracted that behavior a long time ago and there has been very little adoption by plugin devs or daws other then cubase. Steinberg's view is that midi 1.0 or 2.0 should be managed by the daw, not by plugins. Most of the cool 2.0 patch management is more likely to be used between daw and midi controllers rather then through the plugins. But we shall see how it all plays out over time.

    i am also excited about time stamping added and looking forward to a future midi network in the studio all connected via 2.0 interfaces which reduce jitter. But so far there are no midi 2.0 interfaces, only a few midi controllers


  • One thing I have been wondering with regard to the piano libraries is how is it possible to actually take advantage of the resolution at which the instruments have been sampled without a midi 2.0 keyboard or a high resolution keyboard like the Casio PX-5S?

    For example, the Bösendorfer Imperial has 4,000 samples per key but how can you make use of that with standard 7-bit velocity resolution?


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    We're nowhere near the point at which sample player velocity needs or could even benefit from MIDI 2 resolution. Unless of course you happen to have some exotic and very high-price machinery with several TeraBytes of RAM, several dozens of TB of storage, and a very large number of CPU cores that could qualify as an entry-level Supercomputer! And all that's assuming you'll be able to find sample libraries that target such machinery. In short, I'd suggest you don't hold your breath.

    Also, using MIDI 2 to enhance the scope and scale of software instrument plugin preset selection and control - already absurdly overdone by developers in that merciless market - is unlikely to be enthusiastically received by seasoned (and jaded) users; more likely by the "more-is-better" and "latest-is-always-greatest" brigades of noobs, bluffers and con-artists.

    Even at the specification level it's clear that MIDI 2 has its virtues and it's certainly not short of vices; but these won't be obvious to most folks in the user domain ahead of the few truly talented designers who'll take us all nicely into tomorrow in their own inimitable ways and in their own good time.

    Oh but meanwhile, there's always Elon & co who like to pepper their products with what seem to be innovations (but mostly aren't), because hey - how else can they justify their churlishly high prices, keep their cult followers feverishly excited, and bask in all that public adulation? Lol.


    "The US 1st Amendment does NOT allow you to yell "FIRE!" falsely in a packed cinema, nor in an online forum." ~ Dobi (60kg Cane da pastore Maremmano-Abruzzese)