Dietz-
OK, aside from the fact that "private" emails are supposed to be just that, you also blatantly misinterpreted what I said in that not-so-private email. I never said I was going to leave these pages in a huff. I said I was not happy at having my intelligence insluted. But, once again, you are not talking about what I am saying, but HOW. Please, Dietz, I beg of you to get to the content of what I'm saying.
About the CONTENT of what you are saying: here is a direct quote from Herb on the soprano sax thread. (By the way, I already posted this several posts ago.):

"Our expirience with the soprano is: performance legato recording works perfectly in piano, works also perfectly in forte in a slided style, but does not work in normal forte legato." -Herb (on soprano sax thread)

So, you can see that I am not argueing about "taste" - VSL was clearly NOT ABLE to do something (namely create a normal forte soprano legato), and Herb admitted not being able to do it. Michael Hula also admitted not being able to do it because of time limitations. If this is not an objective error (of both technical and business decisions), I don't know what is.
I don't think you guys have bad customer service, you have outstanding customer service in all other areas. Once again, I am not making allegations, just pointing to things that have already been admitted and asking for corrections. Look, I'm not the only one who thinks this, in fact, I didn't even start the thread on the soprano sax legato thing, there were many others who all felt the same way (check the thread). They just gave up arguing it, and I have not. Shall I post a demostration of the flaws in the said patch?
-mvanbebber

|| : - : ||

After reading ALL the sop sax threads, I can safely say that you're the last person that can claim people aren't reading what you are writing. You COMPLETELY glossed over the rest of Herb's explination.
=========================
To use the legato patch for fast movements is of course absolutely nonsense. This patch works only for slower movents.

Our expirience with the soprano is: performance legato recording works perfectly in piano, works also perfectly in forte in a slided style,
but does not work in normal forte legato.

Why? In most of the intervall steps - exactly during the intervalls - a short overtone appeared, therefore it was impossible to extract working legato samples.

That's why we did the performance-marcato-forte patch, where the intervalls are articulated with the tongue (sorry don't know the right english term), and we prepared the glissando patch for a portamento forte style.
So in this case we had to accept that there are simple physical restrictions,
but tried to offer all possible alternatives we could see.

I think, that we sometime forget too fast, that all these samples were performed by real musicians on anologue instruments.

And Mvanbebber, at last I have to say to you:
Making rashly "Junior-Highschool-Comparisons-Statements" is rude and ignorant.

Herb

===========

from reading this and listening to all the demos I can find I know:
A: you're trying to use the wrong patch for the wrong thing and getting frustrated(rightly so)
B Instead of adapting and using the library you purchased to it's full extent you're complaining about what really boils down to a difference of opinion over the labeling of the articulation
C: Dietz is trying to express to you what I pointed out in B, but instead of listening you're using circular arguments to point the finger right back at him and VSL
D. You are very intelligent, know a lot about music and sampling but for some reason you've got tunnel vision on this issue.

Expand your horizons a little, try out layring the patches together or converting them to modwheel as some of the other users have done. Make it a challenge for yourself to write a piece that HAS to use that patch, rather than making it a hinderence. See what you can do with it.

cmpsr2000-
Believe me, I read all of the posts by Herb many times and fully understand them. Herb poses what is known as a "workaround" to substitute for a real forte legato. This is not acceptable, and if you had the library you would hear that it is no substitute (nothing can be.) Why would you substitute marcato in place of legato, like Herb suggests? Do you know what those terms are? They are basically opposites - not viable substitutes for one another.
And saying that this is a dispute over the naming of a patch is completely erroneous. You are "begging the question", to use a canon of debate. You are assuming the legato patch exists, and we are just arguing over what it is called - not the case.
Also, I am not trying to use the wrong patch for the wrong thing, the "right" patch simply does not exist. What I have done for my mockups of jazz tunes is just used the _sus patches, which do not sound like legato at all, but at least play long notes. But the whole reason I bought the library is for VSL's excuisite performance legato, which they were unable to create. Keep in mind that this is the only instrument that they have ever released without being able to create a true legato, so it is quite an anomaly in that way, and I'm more than happy with their other products.
thanks,
mvanbebber

P.S.- How could you have listened to all the demos? I removed them from the file-hosting service many months ago? To which demos are you referring?

@mvanbebber said:

........and you will not hear from me again on this issue. (or see my money again, for that matter.)
thanks,
Mvanbebber

If only that was true [:(] Please start another thread if you want to carry on with this; I have no desire to wade through all this and then find that it is all OT.

DG

@mvanbebber said:

........and you will not hear from me again on this issue. (or see my money again, for that matter.)
thanks,
Mvanbebber

If only that was true [:(] Please start another thread if you want to carry on with this; I have no desire to wade through all this and then find that it is all OT.

DG

DG-
You do not make decions about what is kosher to talk about, so I will thank you to leave your opinions to yourself. Also, I will not remain silent when people either: 1.) Ask me questions about this subject, or 2.) Make false statements. 3.) Make insulting remarks.
thanks,
Mvanbebber

locked without any further comments