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  4. layering solo strings vs dimension strings

  • layering solo strings vs dimension strings

    M
    M
    hey you guys. i`m slowly turning away from special editions complete bundle and looking towards dimension strings and dimension brass. plus ensemble pro player pro and mir pro 24. but i am wondering. with the pro player and its humanize feature is it not possible to build and reconstruc dimension strings with the single instruments and then layer them? if this is true then i would be way better of staying with my first choice the special edition complete bundle and build my own orchestra layer by layer with that(inside the pro player).
  • W
    W

    No it is not possible to layer solo strings to create an ensemble.   You can create with each individual instrument, at best, a duo by transposing and humanizing.  As soon as you layer more it starts to sound artificial, which is why Dimension Strings was created.  They are solo players, but actually playing as an ensemble at the time of recording, and so can be layered in any way you want.   

    However, if you have Solo Strings they ARE excellent to layer with Dimension Strings.  If you have a Solo Violin with the Dimension Violins, the upfront sound of the Solo is a lot like a concertmaster in front of an ensemble.
  • P
    P

    "...which is why Dimension Strings was created."

    Yes. With a solo string, one ponders that if the attacks are scattered, the reverb is varied, and the solo is detuned eight times over, a Dimension String might emerge. Mathematically, it is correct. And that's where it ends. 

    Sample library users have been attempting variations on this since the '90's. And we would not be shelling out a thousand dollars for DS if the sound may be otherwise achieved. Nor would VSL put in the time and incredibly detailed effort to make this happen. 

    But I salute your sampling curousity. If you have the time, it's instructive to try it and hear the result. It's a good example of something that works in theory, not practice.

    Before DS, some managed an acceptable divisi sound with an admixture of solos, chamber, and ensemble. But it was not optimal. Even adding solos here and there to ensemble can add "directionality," if that word exists. But pure, even, credible divisi has not been possible with VSL until now. (And frankly, I prefer eight DS in unison for my first violins over the ensemble patches, particularly with MIR.)

    Coincidentally, using one DS as a concert solo instrument won't get you very far either. 
  • M
    M
    Coincidentally, using one DS as a concert solo instrument won't get you very far either. Why not? I thought gaht the ds would also provide me with the single version of the instruments and thus providing the solo instruments. Since ds has so many articulations i thought this would equal the solo instruments???
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    @marcelw1981 said:

    Coincidentally, using one DS as a concert solo instrument won't get you very far either. Why not? I thought gaht the ds would also provide me with the single version of the instruments and thus providing the solo instruments. Since ds has so many articulations i thought this would equal the solo instruments???

    The reason is the Dimension Strings are not really designed to be heard as solo.  They are individual players miked, but they are playing together and meant to be heard in groups of various sizes.  The individual Solo Strings actually have more articulations in certain areas.  They are more detailed in sampling.  The huge number of samples for the Dimension Strings comes not from the number of articulations, but from the fact there are more players than one, each identically sampled.
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    @marcelw1981 said:

    i`m slowly turning away from special editions complete bundle

    Not a good idea imo, and especially not if you are getting Dimension Strings. SE Orchestral & Chamber Strings can be combined with DS Strings to great effect - Wagner & Mozart examples here being two cases in point.
  • C
    C

    You do get each individual player, but people play differently in a solo situation than they do in an ensemble.  Solo Strings was meant to capture the former, so it won't be as satisfactory for the latter.  DS was meant for ensembles, so it won't be as good for solos.  Can you get away with some solo or near-solo lines with DS?  Absolutely, but I wouldn't put them right up in the front-and-center, but maybe a solo cello line needs to play its own melody over the orchestra, and DS would be satisfactory in that situation.  I wouldn't do a string quartet with DS, but an octet would already work just fine.
  • W
    W

    You' re right about that.  And the thing to keep in mind is the audio recording of Dimension is actually designed to be used as an ensemble, layering the individual players.  Thatis a good idea for an Octet or a larger group of solo instruments. 

    Whereas, with Solo Strings, the audio is designed to highlight each player, alone.  So they work perfectly with other solos, as in a quartet or quintet, or with other librarires as a Concert master or one espressivo layer, but not multiple layers of themselves.