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  4. Couple MIR questions

  • Couple MIR questions

    W
    W

    In preparation for my upcoming purchase of MIR Pro24 and VE Pro, I had a couple questions based on my use of the demo. 

    1.  As I was positioning my players on the stage I realized I wanted to move my woodwind players back a bit.  I couldn't see a way to lasso all of them and move them as a group so it was pretty tedious to move them one at a time.  Was I missing something? 

    2.  Along the lines of positioning are there any pictures out there showing where people place their players and how they're rotated, etc. for the best clarity and separation? 

  • C
    C

    1.  Hold down SHIFT and then highlight all the ones you want.  Then hold ALT and drag them to the new location.

    2.  That is completely subjective, because what I say is clear someone will say is muddy.  What you consider balanced, I consider drowned in reverb.  That question is impossible to answer except by your ears combined with your goals/tastes.

    Maestro2be
  • DietzD
    VSL Team
    DietzD

    Thanks for your answers, Maestro2be!

    One should add that there is an option in its Preferences which allows for treating all selected Channels and Icons as a group, without the need for an additional modifier key (... in VE Pro "Automatically edit selected channels as a group"; in MIR Pro's plug-in version "Auto-group selected channels"). - In any case, double-clicking in an empty spot will unselect all Icons.

    Regarding "muddyness": Changing the Main Microphone's Output Format can change the sound of a Venue considerably. Like a wrote in another thread today: If you want to hear less "space", then it's always a good idea to use virtual microphones that don't pick up so much sound from the back. A good choice would be the "M/S Stereo with Cardioid M", which is available form the huge list of pre-configured setups. - (BTW - the other extreme would be a Blumlein-setup consisting of two crossed Figure-8-capsules: Here you would get as much room-sound from the rear as you get from the front.)

    ... and don't forget that MIR Pro's Room EQ offers a straight-forward way to shape the room-sound of a Venue. Reducing the bass and lower mids by a few dB can do wonders.

    Regarding examples and pictures: VSL's chief Herb Tucmandl has kindly supplied some of his setups for the Teldex Studio Berlin Venue. They are available from your VSL User Area -> http://www.vsl.co.at/en/68/428/1957/1622.htm .

    This is how the Large Orchestra preset looks like:

    The (SE-compatible!) preset for a smaller orchestra:

    HTH,

    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • D
    D

    Dietz,

    There was some discussion about updating these presets to work with MIR Pro 24 here:

    http://community.vsl.co.at/forums/p/31808/202079.aspx#202079

    Any news about when this might occur?  Thanks.
  • DietzD
    VSL Team
    DietzD

    Not very soon, sorry to say so - but we're working on something similar which should cover the needs of MIR Pro 24 users, too. :-)

    Thanks for your patience!

    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • W
    W

    Sorry I've been away for a couple of days but thank you all for the info.  I purchased MirPro24 and VEPro along with a couple other things yesterday so I'm anxious to try all of this out. 

    Thank you again.
  • W
    W

    I've had some time to play with my new toys :) and I'm loving them.  But I do have a couple more questions. 

    • I've downloaded the MIR presets but can't seem to load any of them.  I've looked through all the menus for VEPro and MIRPro24 but nothing seems to work.  I'm not explaining this very well. 
    • I work in Finale.  If you're familiar with Finale, they have 8 banks of which you can load a VST into and each bank comprises 16 midi channels.  So bank 1 covers 1-16, bank 2 covers 17-32, bank 3 covers 33-48 and so on.  Of course each instance of the VST plugin will be set to channels 1-16 but when it comes to VEPro I thought it could handle more than 16 midi channels.  The reason I ask is once I have to load a second instance of VEPro, I then have a "second" instance of MIRPro24.  I know I still have a 24 channel limit, but the instruments I loaded on the first 16 banks don't show up on the second stage so to speak.  Short of running Mir as a standalone plugin, is there a way to get more than 16 midi channels in VEPro? 
    • Last question has to do with the limits of 24 channels.  I have more than 24 instruments, but with my trumpets (and muted trumpets) and trombones, I created a bus for each, sending the individual channels to that bus that in turn had a send to MIR.  That worked just fine, but I wondered if there was a more automated way of doing that. 

    Thanks for your patience with me.
  • D
    D

    AFAIK Finale doesn't use VST3. Therefore you are limited to 16 MIDI channels per instance.

    DG
  • N
    N

    winknotes, for a variety of reasons I do my composing and setting of keyswitches in Finale (ye olde 2005b at that!).  There is a way around the 16 channel limit (2005b only allows for four banks).  Assuming you intend to keep using Finale long-term, consider getting a second computer.  Depending on what you do, one machine could possibly be fairly low end.  Run Finale and whatever other software you use on that, and then run VSL MIR or MIR 24 on the more powerful machine.  Route all your parts via MIDI channels into the computer running MIR, and you will be set.  You can run as many MIDI channels as you need, simply translating FInale's bank numbers into the MIDI outs and the ins for MIR. 

    Granted, that is not an elegant solution, but it is one way around the problem.

    As for MIR 24 vs. MIR Pro, the main advantage to MIR Pro is not being limited to the 24 channels.  I use the older MIR SE, and hopefully will eventually be able to upgrade to full MIR Pro.  For smaller ensembles MIR 24 would work just fine, but larger sized orchestras it could prove problematical.
  • W
    W

    Thanks for the reply noldar12.  I have thought of a 2nd machine, but running everything on my machine isn't really an issue so far plus I'm contemplating getting an SSD for the samples.   I might be able to accomplish the same thing running VEPro as a standalone plugin, but even then I don't see how you could have more than 16 channels in a single instance of VEPro. 

    I'm reading up on the event input plug-in thinking that may be the answer but I don't completely understand that.  What I wonder is if I have a standalone instance of VEPro running connected to the server.  Then in Finale's banks (say I need 32 channels) I load an event input plug-in that would in turn connect to the single instance.  I could then set my instruments in Finale's instrument list to their respective midi channel, load the instruments in VEPro and I'm off to the races.  Not sure if it works that way though.

    EDIT:  It doesn't work as outlined above running VEPro as a standalone.  I guess VEPro has to be a VST in the host application to work which also makes it appear that it won't work in Finale.
  • N
    N

    I forgot to mention that I do run MIR SE stand alone.

    A bit OT, but FWIW, I ended up using the two computer setup way back (pre-VSL days) due to an odd bug in an older version of Sonar (was it 4???) where I would get stuck notes on samples when using MIDI within Sonar when doing adjustments to Sonar's tempo track, but discovered that I did not have any problems when routing the same MIDI (i.e. the tempo adjustments) externally to samples on a different computer.  Since then, I've simply stayed with the two computer setup, and depending on the size of one's template, there are some advantages to using two systems.
  • DietzD
    VSL Team
    DietzD
    last edited
    last edited

    @Another User said:

    Last question has to do with the limits of 24 channels.  I have more than 24 instruments, but with my trumpets (and muted trumpets) and trombones, I created a bus for each, sending the individual channels to that bus that in turn had a send to MIR.  That worked just fine, but I wondered if there was a more automated way of doing that. 

    Thanks for your patience with me.

    The "more automated way" would be to get the full version of MIR Pro. 😊 Like that you wouldn't have to create sub-mixes and could use the dedicated, individual Instrument Profiles.

    Kind regards,

    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • andiA
    VSL Team
    andiA

    Hi winknotes_282!

    It is indeed possible with the VE Pro Event Input to get all your Finale channels into one VE Pro instance and this way to one MIR Pro (24) stage.

    - Add VE Pro to the first Bank in Finale.
    - In VE Pro set the MIDI In port for your instruments playing on channels 1 to 16 to "1".
    - Add VE Pro Event Input to the second Bank in Finale and assign MIDI Input 2.
    - In VE Pro set the MIDI In port for your instruments playing on channels 17 to 32 to "2" and the channels to 1 to 16.
    - You can do the same with Banks 3 to 8.

    Best regards,
    Andi

    Vienna Symphonic Library
  • W
    W

    Aha brilliant andi.  That's exactly what I was looking for.  Many thaniks for that.