@Stefan said:

In case of a broken or faulty key......

Whoa.......  that is a scarey high cost that has got me very concerned.  My VSL key has 60 VSL licences. although most of that was bought as one package (The Super Package), it ends up with a lot of separate licences, So at the cost of 20Euro per licence, that would cost me over 1200 Euros - yes that's right, one thousand two hundred euros, just to get what I have already paid for back into a new key,

So does this mean we need to buy a new key every 2 years and move all licenses to the new key,

@Stefan said:

In case of a broken or faulty key......

Whoa.......  that is a scarey high cost that has got me very concerned.  My VSL key has 60 VSL licences. although most of that was bought as one package (The Super Package), it ends up with a lot of separate licences, So at the cost of 20Euro per licence, that would cost me over 1200 Euros - yes that's right, one thousand two hundred euros, just to get what I have already paid for back into a new key,

So does this mean we need to buy a new key every 2 years and move all licenses to the new key,

Unless you have insurance, I would recommend this.

DG

This is rather strange.

If the Dongle is broken and returned to VSL when if it is outside of the guarantee period and you have to pay the cost of a new dongle then that is straightforward.

However the license itself is not subject to a guarantee period so I cannot see how DG's suggestion to purchase a VSL dongle every 24 months to avoid re-license fees is a viable solution.  I suspect if the terms and conditions of the dongle guarantee are examined closely you will find they don't extent to the licenses held on the dongle - purely it's functionality as a storage device.

I do believe a more transparent system is urgently needed.

The dongle is only a copyright protection device of minimal cost yet it has the potetnial to hold many thousands of £/€/$ of valuable licenses.

My understanding has always been if a dongle containing the licenses becomes faulty and if it is returned to VSL and found to be so then all the licenses should be restored to a new dongle at a cost not exceeding the price of a new dongle.

The problem could be how can VSL confirm if the dongle held the licenses in the first place? If there has been physical damage to the key - liquid, fire, impact and it doesn't work in the owner's computer then there is every chance that VSL or their agents will have no way of verifying if the licences were ever on the key.

Unfortunately insurance to protect against accidental damage or theft to a dongle is either extremely expensive or doesn't actually provide full cover if all the exclusions, excesses and limitations are taken into account.

I think as the potential finacial loss due to dongle issues spirals with each new library/product released (and affects VSL's most loyal customers most) then a system that could avoid the financial catastrophy of a simple dongle accident/theft should be investigated further.

My understanding is that, under the current somewhat vague situation, someone could purchase a new set of licenses costing thousands of euros, accidentally kick the dongle sticking out of their computer and loose a hefty wad of money!

My experience of VSL is an exemplary company with great customer service but there do appear to be some grey areas concerning the protection key side of things. 

Julian

@Stefan said:

If the warranty period has expired, it might be necessary to purchase replacement licenses for a handling fee of EUR 30 + EUR 20 per license. A replacement key costs the regular price of EUR 24 / GBP 20.

This was troubling to read, and will impact decisions on whether to expand my palette of VSL instruments or not. I've got 9 licenses stored on my key, and the cost of replacing a faulty key with these licenses alone would be a hard blow for me, being a hobbyist with a limited budget to spend on my passion. I was planning on getting some of the download instruments, not so sure anymore.

 The Super package comes with 41 licences, although it is bought as one package,  it would cost 850 Euros (820 + 30 Euros) to get the licences put back into a faulty key.

I have to agree that the current policy of VSL in case of a damaged dongle is quite absurd.

Being forced to pay 20 Euros for each single license in case a dongle is damaged?

That's like turning the misfortune of your customers into a profitable business!

It means that those customers who have invested a lot of money in VSL libraries and who therefore are the greatest supporters of VSL as a company are punished the most, because they will literally have to pay hundreds of Euros to replace a damaged dongle! 

I think that is VERY unfair and unreasonable.

If I had known this policy before purchasing licenses I would have thought twice about purchasing any license.

It would be much more reasonable if we could simply back up each license in a non-activated state on a spare dongle, so that in the case a dongle is damaged, we would simply be able to send the damaged dongle to VSL and activate the licenses on the spare dongle.

Hello,

What if the iLok is so much damaged, mayby by fire that there is no possibility to read anything from it? Or it get stolen? I do not understand why there is no option of an unique "Mac" Address, in the iLok like on W-LAN-Cards which is connected to the License.
In case of an unfortunate event VSL could change the "Mac" Address to the new buyed iLok, and so the licenses are still only on one key.
To avoid abuse the iLok could check in a period of time (all 15-30 days) if the "Mac" Address is valid. The only thing what´s needed is an internet-connection. And that´s something we all have. :-)

regards

Torsten

1. VSL doesn't use iLok
2. We don't all have Internet connections on our production machines.

DG 

@DG said:

1. VSL doesn't use iLok
2. We don't all have Internet connections on our production machines.

DG 

1. You´re right. My fault. e-licenser but does not change anything

2. But you must have one to download the license ones. And I think it´s more welcome to let it check periodic, than pay again for something you have allready payed for, right? 😊

regards

Torsten

@ToTeMusik said:

2. But you must have one to download the license ones. And I think it´s more welcome to let it check periodic, than pay again for something you have allready payed for, right? 😊

regards

Torsten

Of course you're entitled to your opinion, but I have no wish to dismantle my studios every few days just because some people don't wish to purchase a new dongle every couple of years.

DG

@DG said:

1. VSL doesn't use iLok
2. We don't all have Internet connections on our production machines.

DG 

1. You´re right. My fault. e-licenser but does not change anything

2. But you must have one to download the license ones. And I think it´s more welcome to let it check periodic, than pay again for something you have allready payed for, right? 😊

regards

Torsten

Couldn't agree more - as it is we all have to do periodic updates to the e-licensor software on our studio machines so to have periodic licenses checks would be far more palatable than living with the potentially very high cost of re-placing licenses lost from a damaged or mislaid key.

Insurance against such issues may be available but is generally very expensive and with numerous exclusions/excesses and even if viable any claim would likely make the total policy re-newal cost rise sbstantially such is the modus operandi of insurance companies.

Julian

@ToTeMusik said:

2. But you must have one to download the license ones. And I think it´s more welcome to let it check periodic, than pay again for something you have allready payed for, right? 😊

regards

Torsten

Of course you're entitled to your opinion, but I have no wish to dismantle my studios every few days just because some people don't wish to purchase a new dongle every couple of years.

DG

DG do I get you right that you buy every two (couple) years a new key and switch your license over?
I´m thinking about possible problems while transfering them over.

I do not know where you live but in germany you have 2 years guarantee BUT this is divided in one year gurantee and one warranty (that means, that you have to prove that the hardware-damage was there on the day you bought it). So in a case of 
an unfortunate event you can hope that the manufacturer is in a good mode...

And what will you do if someone breaks into your studio and steal your keys with all your license or its totaly destroyed by what ever?
If I understand VSL right than you have to buy a new key AND all products for full price again.
If so I think not many people here on this forum can handle this and will! 😊
I could not and thats the reason I´ve stopped to take it with my Laptop for working outside.

Another way could be to buy a single key for each License to keep the lost low, of course your PC will look then like a mushroom. 😄

regards

Torsten

@ToTeMusik said:

in germany you have 2 years guarantee BUT this is divided in one year gurantee and one warranty

This is wrong, and often misunderstood.

In Germany you have warranty (Gewaehrleistung) ensured by law, and this is, where after the first year you have to prove that the damage has been there before (Beweislastumkehr)

Guarantee (Garantie) is given you by the manufacturer on a voluntary base, and it's scope depends entirely on the terms of the company.

So if VSL guarantees you the functionality of their dongle for 2 years, is really means 2 years without any restrictions. If they would give you 5 years, it would be 5. If they'd give you not any guarantee at all the legal warranty would come in.

@The Lighthouse Sleeper said:

... if anyone has had the misfortune to have a broken key I would be interested to hear how it was dealt with. Thanks very much for your attention.

I don't know if this is unusual or if there has been a change in policy but this anecdote is true.

I wounder how long it took to get all this done?
It´s nice to hear that VSL and Steinberg worked fast but how long you could not work?

And still there´s the question what will happen in a case of stealing/total lost.

I remember a threat here a while ago where someone got stolen his MAC? with all Sticks on it but haven´t heard anything about the end of the story.

regards

Torsten

I lost almost no time, maybe a couple of days. Christian here provided me with demo licenses in the meantime. For one option, one can buy a Vienna Key which has 180 starts for all licenses, which I did in addition. 

This happened right before a (US) holiday. There was no one answering Steinberg phones, but I got an email response within a couple of hours, which was fortunate as there could have been four days I couldn't have moved at all on this.