Pitch bends, glissandi, retuning, slides (in Finale...or otherwise)

[Newbis]

Hi,
 Is there a way to get Vienna Ensemble / VSL SE to do pitch bends, portamenti (smooth glissandi), and tuning changes, either in Finale, or in a DAW?
  In Finale, when using the Garritan instruments, there's an easy way to re-tune an instrument, at least if one wants the entire instrument retuned. One simply sets the "pitchwheel" setting for playback, assigned to an expression mark.
  Similarly, if I can write a glissando between notes, and Finale plays the notes for Garritan instruments like a "slide."
  However, with VSL instruments, the pitchwheel setting has no effect. Similarly, if I write a glissando, I get lots of notes, like a scale, rather than a smooth "slide" like a get with the Garritan instruments.
  Surely there must be a way to change the tunings of VSL instruments and to get a "slide" effect?
  If not in Finale, is there a way to do it when using other software?
Thanks,
-Jonathan

[Newbis]

PS...I partly answered my own question. I see that I can tune the "Master Tune" in Vienna Ensemble up or down to integers other than 440, from 420 to 460 for a given instrument.
I actually wanted to tune it to 461 but am having no luck. :-| (Looks as if 200 cents is the maximum limit one can set.)
Still wondering though how about slides....
Thanks,
-Jonathan

[andi]

Hello Jonathan!

Creating slides with pitch bend going over more than two semitones wouldn't sound good. That's the main reason, why the maximum pitch bend range in the Vienna Instruments player is 200 cent. Some of our bigger collections (like Orchestral Strings) include glissando articulations.

Best regards,
Andi

[Newbis]

I see. Actually, I realize the fact that I can't adjust the pitch above 460 or below 420 is unrelated to the 200-cent limit. 200 cents above 420 would be 471. 420 and 460 are each a little bit less than a semitone on either side of 440.

Anyhow, regarding other articulations, if they're not in SE, can they be purchased separately if I decide I need them?

Thanks,
-Jonathan

[andi]

Sorry, but articulations can not be bought separately. A detailed list of included instruments and articulations can be found with every product on our product pages under "Sample Content".

Best,

Andi

[civilization 3]

@andi said:

Hello Jonathan!

Creating slides with pitch bend going over more than two semitones wouldn't sound good.

with the acoustic instruments this is surely true. But, the overdrive guitar is tbh lacking in this regard, a whammy bar dive can be dramatically wider than a tone. and there isn't a workaround I can even imagine.

(in practice, a pitch bend in this instrument tends to sound as a whammy bar, more than as an actual bend performed by the hand. this [whammy bar] is a real part of the style this instrument seeks to capture)

[andi]

Hello civilzation 3!

We have several articulations with whammy bar included in our Overdrive extended collection.

Best regards,

Andi

[Cello Beagle]

To do a smooth slide, look at the Finale forum under Finale/Macintosh on page 2 under "Glissando" it does have a limit of 1 octave, but it will trigger the "portamento" sample of the VSL library.

[civilization 3]

@andi said:

We have several articulations with whammy bar included in our Overdrive extended collection.

Yes, I am familiar, I have that. 'sustain - wb 1' and 'sustain - wb 2', which are vibrato articulations; there is a sort of whammy bar dive that's attacked with a scratch, 'fx - scratch_wb' (although it could just be that the 'dive' is the scratch itself, and again some wambly vibrato), but... I am just making the case for a wider pitch bend in the player, because it can work more or less to the same effect, one that I can't get with the given artics.

[sibeliusmusic]

I see glissandi for the violins in the Orchestral Strings Bundle, but not the violas, 'celli or basses. Is it correct that there is no glissandi on these instruments?

[andi]

Hello Steve!

Yes, that's correct. Glissandi are only included with the Orchestral Violins.

Best,
Andi

[John Melcher]

@andi said:

Hello Jonathan!

Creating slides with pitch bend going over more than two semitones wouldn't sound good. That's the main reason, why the maximum pitch bend range in the Vienna Instruments player is 200 cent.

Best regards,
Andi

Wouldn't it be better to provide it and let your users decide if it sounds "good" or not? I just bought Dimension Strings (my first VSL library) and was disappointed to take a step backwards from Gigastudio in this regard. I found that +/-3 semitones was usually okay, making controlled tritone glissandos possible. Seriously, it seems like a relatively trivial programming task, withheld because someone made an aesthetic decision on my behalf. John Melcher

[civilization 3]

I agree wholeheartedly. I don't buy that argument. I think a lot of pitch bend is dodgy with certain instruments, but as a universal concept it can't be very true. I think our intelligence was just insulted 'wouldn't sound good, that's the reason'. Sometimes any pitch bend 'wouldn't sound good', depending.

The Overdrive Guitar, well, restricting the pitch bend to two semitones is a restriction the instrument just doesn't have, wider bends are idiomatic and it makes for an instrument that's been cut down. That isn't thought through at all. For instance a whammy bar dive could be very wide and pitch bend is fairly close in effect, but no.

Let's take SampleModeling's saxophones: pitch bend is part of the M.O. of getting the effect of the horn. It's not all strings in the VSL libraries.

[John Melcher]

Given this constraint, my options are: - Use a different sample library (i.e., Kirk Hunter Solo Strings with Gigastudio); - Break longer glissandi into pieces and try to cover the seams; - Rewrite the music to fit what VSL allows me to do. Or VSL could make a small programming change and allow me to make the aesthetic decisions as to what sounds "good" (realistic). It's also possible I might WANT to do something radical that doesn't sound like a real orchestra.