@requiem_aeternam7 said:

no need to get defensive CM it only reeks of insecurity

i don't look at my reply as beeing defensive or reeking, it is just to put some figures into the right context.

 i don't like so much to speak in terms of last or current or next generation or qualifying product A as good and product B as bad.

i agree there may be a gap between the special edition and the full strings package which (in your case) could be filled partly with the special edition PLUS' sample content - you could also extend only the strings section with the ORCHESTRA Special Edition Strings PLUS

for certain reasons there are no single instruments download products available , which again could extend the SE + SE PLUS like with the other instrument sections.

i think VSL has proven the concept is not the worst one could think of and the modular structure meets many user's needs. it would be sad if there wouldn't be some space for improvements.

christian

I agree that the 'modular' concept model is in fact the best ever invented (whether it was invented by you guys or whomever else) because it allows us the customers the freedom to pick and choose what is right for US. However as others have pointed out perhaps if the modular concept would be expanded to allow even more specific choices for people who want certain things but not certain other things, etc, then maybe the model will be even more successful. As you can see by the responses here, which represent only a small amount of the vast sea of voices that I've heard mention this before on other forums, there are many people that would upgrade certain articulations etc if they could do so without paying huge amounts of money and having to purchase other things that they won't use, etc.

@requiem_aeternam7 said:

something with your memory seems to be in disorder. Special Edition was around $1,500

now let us look at option two (something with your registration is in disorder):

- the special edition standard library at the time of purchase was USD 495.-

- i can see you ordered the full library for USD 1.170.-, but:

- you never registered and so never received a license for the extended library.

- i'll double check what happened to that serial number certificate to look less like an ass.

christian

I'll be honest, all these different library names confuse the hell out of me. I don't even recall what it is that I ordered I just know that it was in that $1000+ price range and NOT 400$+

I have had a demo key of 100 some-odd starts for what I THINK is the extended edition. This 'demo' key just ran out about 3 days ago to my knowledge. It's all really confusing to me but are you telling me that I should have the full 'extended edition' key rather than just the demo key for a certain amount of starts? If that's the case then please don't hesitate to send me the new full key. [H]

you should have received 2008-05-22 (alongside with your special edition box) a serial number certificate with a serial number for the extended library.

i have already contacted the distributor who sent you the box and asked to double check on this issue before sending you a copy from our side - we are sorry if this sheet of paper didn't reach your desk properly.

for security and in case i don't hear back from them within the next few hours i've sent you a demo mode #2 code to allow you continuing your work.

christian

edit: please do not forget no vsldaemon must be running when adding the demo license (or any license), in doubt reboot before and watch the message after successful license download asking *start usage period now?*

Ah..I think I finally understand what you're saying (sorry all this is confusing as all hell to me).

I'm checking in my vienna box now, I only have one 18 character serial number. I'm assuming this is for standard edition. So the one for "extended edition" you're saying is what I never received? I don't see any other one. Luckily I guess I don't compose that often because after almost 2 years extended edition only JUST expired its demo mode a couple days ago (yesterday I think) LOL! So, then that means I still need to receive an extended edition separate new license from you folks?

-Thanks

to dig the opening post up again ... the answer was maybe buried between the lines:

for certain reasons there are no single instruments downloads of the strings section as with the other instrument groups (flutes & reeds, clarinets & bassoons, ect).

those single instrument download products extend the articulations of the special edition, but do still not provide the full content of the larger DVD collections ... how could they.

currently there are no plans to release solo/chamber/orchestral/appassionata violins/violas/celli/bassi single instrument download products, sorry.

christian

@cm said:

to dig the opening post up again ... the answer was maybe buried between the lines:

for certain reasons there are no single instruments downloads of the strings section as with the other instrument groups (flutes & reeds, clarinets & bassoons, ect).

those single instrument download products extend the articulations of the special edition, but do still not provide the full content of the larger DVD collections ... how could they.

currently there are no plans to release solo/chamber/orchestral/appassionata violins/violas/celli/bassi single instrument download products, sorry.

christian

i think i've read your request right - for all sections (of the special edition) except the striings there are *extension packs* as single instrument download products.

such extensions are currently not planned to be released for the strings - sorry.

christian

The thing is, what you're asking for seems to be an extremely specified a-la-carte' menu where you would be able to order exactly and only what you wanted. I mean, lets say they did release an extended version of things like what you are asking for. Okay, obviously, it wouldnt be "fair" to prior DVD customers for you to get the EXACT articulations that *I* have paid a buttload of money for... So instead, lets say they offered some sort of slimmed-down version of it.

Lets use Orch Strings1 as an example. Lets say they whittled it down to include many (but not ALL of  - as i mentioned earlier about "unfairness") of the Orch Strings 1  extended articulations... Lets say they offered a package which extended to you  Glissandi, Con Sordino, all the perf-repetitions, all the extra  dynamics patches, the fast perf-intervals, the scale runs, Fast Repetitions.. Lets call that the Bargain Extended Plus Orch Strings 1 package.

No matter how well this may suit exactly what you wanted, someone is going to come along and say "Why did you leave out the DYNAMIC Perf-repititions?!?! Why no Isolated Repetitions Resources?!?! Why can i get Fast Repetitions but no Upbeat Reps!!! NO FAIR!"

Then there would STILL be articulations that SOMEONE felt was unfairly left out and they would feel as if they are being strong-armed into buying the WHOLE DVD collection if they TRULY want everything. At what point do you draw the line of what is fair concerning how to cut everything up? I mean, taking your general request to the extreme, would you expect some sort of pick-and-choose system where one could specifically order a Performance Repetition Harsh Dynamics Decrescendo only for E5# only (3.99 USD)? One scale run on the Violin G string from D4 to D5 only (99 cents!) ? I'd like the Ponticello Strong Dynamics 2 Seconds for C3, E3 and F3 (1.99 USD per note = 5.97 total!)?

Im not trying to say you are implying such ridiculous dividing of  articulations, but at SOME point SOMEONE is going to insist they felt left out and are being discriminated against because of what they have already previously paid for. 

Simply put, VSL cant make a package that is 100% going to please EVERY single customer concerning every single articulation that they need.

@clamnectar said:

I'm not just talking about MY specific needs... the glaring hole in the special edition bundle is the lack of articulations that facilitate fast playing on all instruments. If there's anything to add, it's that. I'm sure most special edition customers who have pushed their bundle to the limits have noticed this as well. Presuming that the number of special editing buyers is large, there's significant demand to fill in the gaps. You can do it piece by piece with the winds and brass, but when it comes to the strings, your only option is to plunk down $9000, something that VERY few special edition customers can afford (I mean, if they could have, they probably would have bought the full bundle in the first place). The additional rub is that the $9000 is mostly spent on buying marginally higher quality versions of the SAME articulations that already come with the special edition bundle. But that's beside the point. As a satisfied customer who wants more strings, I find myself with nothing left to buy (unless I win the lottery). I think that's a failure on the part of VSL. I think the best solution would be ~$1000 DVD package that serves as "special edition plus plus." But CM has shot this down, either because their sales figures don't support my assertions, or because they don't want to piss off anyone who spent $9000 for all the strings, or because they are making a business mistake. Whatever the reason, it's a shame. I hope I've made my opinion clear now.

Hint me a little more and give me some suggestions please! (private message perhaps?)

@clamnectar said:

Actually, I also want to illustrate with an example. Looking at this... http://vsl.co.at/en/211/442/344/352/579/393.htm There are only two or three articulations in the Standard library that are not in the Special Edition Bundle. The slogan 'never pay for the same sample twice' may apply TECHNICALLY, if half tone interval sampling is worth another $675, but... it looks to me more like you're paying $675 to get absolutely nothing. Doesn't that strike anyone else as wacky? I still can't wrap my head around this pricing.

Dude, you are getting TWICE the amount of samples (if not more) due to the chromatic samples. You may not think thats a big deal, but it is huge. Trust me. It really does add to the realism having the extra legato/portamento half-tone samples. You may say, but yeah i dont care about that, its not that big of a deal to me... Well, then why do you care so much about the fast-legato samples? If realism is important, half-tone samples and true fast legatos are crucial. If realism isnt that important, then just use whole-tone samples and edit your attack time on your regular legato samples.

You're turning this into a "What i hate about VSL" thread. 

 Not to mention that you're getting more velocity layers in, I think, all of the articulations which, as mplaster points out, adds to the realism.

I used to think that the SE was just a watered down version of the Cube but it's more like what's left in the water after the Cube is watered down.  Big, big difference.

Okay, so I have nothing to do with this conversation and I am adding my two cents a year later, but as pointless as it may seem... I feel it is appropriate in case anyone ever reads this who is trying to find people comparing EW to VSL (as a google search of HS vs VSL brought me here).

A friend of mine is an avid EW fan and owner, he owns everything they have. I am a new VSL owner (just the Special Edition, for now (bwa ha ha)) but I would challenge everyone debating on what company to invest in... to one thing; let VSL speaks for itself.

I play with Hollywood Strings on my friends computer and I notice two things consistantly: 1) Bad software - their software doesn't seem to work correctly, glitches when I play the controller while samples load (My wonderful VSL doesn't), and the organization of samples is chaotic. 2) Bad sound - Hollywood strings, like all other 'East Wurst tomatoes' sounds incredibly pale, and dead.

VSL, under the microscope I find very small problems (which I can always work around with ease)... but with Eastwest, I can't even play for about 10 seconds and I already miss my VSL because the difference in quality is night and day.

-Sean

P.S. Is 1,000,000 crappy samples worth 300,000 superb samples? I would rather have a 4 octave bosendorfer instead of an 88-key out-of-tune yamaha.

Hello

Now it is up to VSL to think about an upgrade between Downloaded Instrument and DVD collection.

I have try to do a little table with the Flute instrument (not obvious as sometimes it is not so clear but it give you a general overhaul)

You get the discount when you upgrade to Extended Library and you pay the full price on the standard library

if you look at the columns of the tables there are not a lot of articulation between the Donwloaded and the Standard and you pay the full price

In contrario there is a lot of articulations between DVD standard and DVD extended and you get the discount 

I love VSL products, but if VSL wants more money from me it will have to rethink about the situation an put the discount to DVD standard

Best

Cyril