Dynamics problem in Sibelius with two instances of Vienna

[Pekay]

I create a test score with following instruments: Flute 1 Flute 2 Horn 1 Horn 2 Then I assign one instance of Vienna Ensemble to the flutes and another instance to the horns. I also change the Map Control so that Expression (CC11) controls Velocity Crossfader. Dynamics, such as piano, forte and hairpins, work fine for the first instance. But on the second instance, nothing happens. Can you help me to figure out the solution. Pekay

[andi]

Hello Pekay!

What do you mean with nothing happens? Dynamics don't work or nothing at all works with the second instance?
Did you enable Vel Xfade with CC11 for both Vienna Ensemble instances?
Did you make program and channel settings on the Manual Sound Sets page for both VE instances?

Btw.: These four instruments could easily be handled with one VE instance, but maybe you activated two instances for testing purposes.

Best regards,
Andi

[Pekay]

With "nothing happens" I mean that Vienna doesn't react on the dynamic signs in the score. Forte doesn't make the music louder, for example. Yes, I enabled Vel Xfade for both instances. Yes, I made program and channel settings for both instances. The real score has 24 instruments, this only a test. Pekay

[andi]

Just enabling Vel XFade is not enough. You also have to assign C11 to the fader. You can do that on the Perform/Map Control page. Please do that for both VE instances you have opened.

Best,
Andi

[Pekay]

I've done that. Pekay

[andi]

Please check again. Maybe you have added CC11 to Vel.xfadde On/Off instead Velocity crossfader.
Do articulation changes work for the horns? Are the dynamic changes the only thing that does not work?

[Pekay]

I seem to do all the right things. I've tested several times beginning from scratch. Sometimes it works, other times not. There's one possible source of problem that I haven't tested yet. Occasionally, Sibelius doesn't seem to be able to place the instruments in the right instance of VE. This causes, for example, both horns to play in the same channel. I have tried to fix this manually in the Sibelius mixer. I'm not sure but maybe something weird happens after this operation. Pekay

[andi]

If you have set up programs and channels for both VE instances on the Manual Sound Sets page, Sibelius shouldn't choose the wrong instance. In your case you need two channels with the Sound ID wind.flutes.flute on VE instance 1 and two channels with the Sound ID wind.horns.french horn on VE instance 2.

If you have that right and there still seems to be weird behaviour, I recommend creating the problematic instrument(s) once again, cutting the content from the old staff and pasting it into the new one.

Andi

[Pekay]

I did as you said, created the problematic instruments again. And now the problem appears. This is what happens: I create a new instrument and make it Flute 1. I copy the music from the old Flute 1 (that didn't work) to the new one. Now the new Flute 1 works as it should. Then I delete the old Flute 1. I create a new Flute 2 and copy the music from the old one, as above. What happens now is that both Flute 1 and Flute 2 play on the same channel in Vienna, that is, the Flute 1 channel. The dynamics work right for both flutes. But, of course, they should not be on the same channel. So, I go to the Sibelius mixer and change the channel for Flute 2 and make it channel 2. Now, the dynamics do not work anymore. Well, at least I can explain to you how the problem appears. Any ideas? Pekay

[andi]

Sometimes Sibelius has problems with channel assignment when the same instrument is used more than once. Changing the channel in the Sibelius mixer often creates even stranger behaviour. You can do the following thing:

Go to the Sibelius mixer and reassign the Sound ID (third line in the mixer) of the problematic instrument(s). Be careful to assign it in the right order. For example the first line with "wind.flutes.flute" for the first flute and the second line with "wind.flutes.flute" for the second flute.

I hope this will solve your problems.

Best,

Andi

[Pekay]

I'll try that. Thank you very much for your patient help! Pekay

[zentrumsounds]

Just thought I'd add a voice of frustration to the choir... I'm have this problem again and again. My most recent scenario was where I created to Solo Violin staves in Sibelius and sent the data to VEPro. It seemed to work fine, and then I realised that Violin 1 was ignoring [reset] messages whilst Violin 2 accepted them just fine. So if I created a series of notes in Violin 1 where the first batch were normal, and then went to staccato and then returned to normal, the staccato articulation would stick. Copy this data to Violin 2 and it works just fine! I came to the conclusion (after a day and a night of frustration) that the answer was a corrupted score. So I rebuilt the score from scratch and now it works fine.

The frustrating thing with Sibelius is that there is no way of seeing the Sound ID being sent at any given time. So you never know where the problem lies in the chain! I wish they'd fix this in the future!!!

Incidentally, if I erased the violins in the offending score and readded them then almost always Sibelius would choose Violin 2 as the source for BOTH Violins... ridiculously fickle!

Jürgen