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Simsy, looking into your registered products i'm under the impression you might run short with 12 GB (what would be sufficient for the special edition) - i'd consider to instantly start with 24 GB ...
system: ~ 1GB, IR: ~ 4GB -> ~6 GB left for loading patches .... if that is according to your usual method of arranging its OK though.
sidenote: you also may find needing to spread the sample content across 2 disks
christian
Re: RAM
In a stress test I ran today, I had 50 indivdual VIs playing glitch-free at the same time in stereo, latency set to 1024 samples, CPU @ 80%, with a system comparable to the one you outlined above (12 GB RAM). I used 11.2 GB RAM for this setup, with Nuendo 4 for MIDI output on the same machine.
Taking into account MIR's abilitiy for dynamic processing (only those VI's that really play will use MIR's convolution core and thus tax the CPU), you will most likely run out of RAM before the CPU overloads. :-)
HTH,
Hi CM,
Yeah, on my current VE 3 slave I have a lot more RAM than that. But the i7 motherboards only have 6 DIMM slots and it is very hard to find more than 2GB DIMMS without them being really expensive!!! I might load 12GB in for now and have to reduce my template until 4GB DIMMS come down in price.
Do you know of any relevantly cheap 4GB DIMMS?
Also, Dietz, very interesting with the 50 instruments!!! That is very impressive, is there a dramatic fall in number of VI's when you reduce the latency to 512? Really looking forward to this product by the way!
Can't believe you guys are online on a Saturday night [:D]
Kingston ValueRAM DIMM Kit 12GB PC3-8500U CL7 (DDR3-1066) (KVR1066D3N7K3/12G) 3 x 4 GB is sold heree for about EUR 1.000.-
(note: having 2 modules per channel will drop memory bus frequency down to 1066 anyway)
interestingly the server modules (for XEON 5520 series, ECC) are sold for EUR 200.- per 4 GB module .... strange, isn't it?
christian
@Dietz said:
In a stress test I ran today, I had 50 indivdual VIs playing glitch-free at the same time in stereo, latency set to 1024 samples, CPU @ 80%, with a system comparable to the one you outlined above (12 GB RAM). I used 11.2 GB RAM for this setup, with Nuendo 4 for MIDI output on the same machine.
This is really useful information Dietz. Certainly I use more Instruments (about 120), but rarely more than 70 playing at the same time. Obviously 1024 latency is useless for programming the MIDI, so how does that work, bearing in mind I'm used to working on my current system at 128? Is there a super-efficient mode for low latency use?
DG
DG, please keep in mind this is on an i7 system and reduction of latency increases CPU load, not necessarily in a linear manner though.
more powerful systems (eg. using 2 x XEON W5580 = 16 virtual cores) will help, but i', not sure if 128 would be even possible ... maybe wait for the 6 core XEONS announced for early 2010
christian
EDIT: i just noticed that obviously it _is_ possible to get down to 128 on a 2 x XEON 5580W machine - this is more than i dared to hope for ...
@cm said:
DG, please keep in mind this is on an i7 system and reduction of latency increases CPU load, not necessarily in a linear manner though.
more powerful systems (eg. using 2 x XEON W5580 = 16 virtual cores) will help, but i', not sure if 128 would be even possible ... maybe wait for the 6 core XEONS announced for early 2010
christian
EDIT: i just noticed that obviously it _is_ possible to get down to 128 on a 2 x XEON 5580W machine - this is more than i dared to hope for ...
I fully understand that MIR can't possible work properly at low latency with current computers, but there needs to be a mode where one can at least play the notes in (with various real time controllers) at low latency. I play everything live, and in the case of Woods and Brass, I do all the expression with a BC, which has to work live at low latency. If MIR can't be by-passed when in input mode, then it becomes much less useful.
DG
Hi guys,
Don't know if anyone still remember me.
I've finally settled down for graduate. So finally I can get back to VSL community. Also finally I ordered VI for myself - although only Solo Strings I and Appassionata Strings I. 2500 dollars is a lot of money in China, espeically for a student:)
Looks like you guys are talking about supercomputer now! MIR is definitely a mir-acle:), this will render my research useless:) But I'm glad that such an easy to use environmental reverb exists. Although I don't know if I can buy that after its getting out. But I will buy it immediately if I can.
I'm now using a dual quad Xeon 5410 with 8GB RAM. I have to say that core number is only one question. Applications have to be fully optimized for multi-thread or multi-core in order to make full use of CPU. There are some problem with DAW on windows. I'm using Ableton Live now but I found that Live will drop out even my CPU has only 50% usage. I just hope that MIR is fully opitimized for multicore. cause in my view, multi-IR convolution is kind of parallel work so It is great for multicore.
Also, Core i7's integrated on-chip memory controller and L3 cache design can greatly improve memory performance. So I think that's why VI will run faster on i7. But i still believe memory bandwidth is only one factor on processing power. Processor's raw power will always be the most important factor.
and BTW, there always been supercomputer somewhere. I've seen 256 Xeon CPU server when it's 2002 in my city's electricity control center. Although these machines are for industrial control or more mission critical environment like finacial data center or something like that. My point is that there always are ways to build SMP(Symmetrical Multi-Processors) computers with 64, 128 or more CPU or cores using Server CPU like Xeon. But this always is my fantasy to have such a computer for music production :)
And, I don't think my 8 core Xeon 5410 with 8GB RAM will be enough for MIR and VI....may be
Also, BTW, it's good to be back.
I have the same question about inputting midi while using Mir. All the examples that have been given seem to use really high (1024) latency settings. From a composition/workflow standpoint, how does one input lines at lower latency?
@ozoufonoun_29353 said:
I have the same question about inputting midi while using Mir. All the examples that have been given seem to use really high (1024) latency settings. From a composition/workflow standpoint, how does one input lines at lower latency?
May be we could only use faster computers for MIR. Lower latency means higher computing intensity. So logically only solution should be using faster computers.
I can bare with 256-512 samples ASIO buffer size for composition. But no one is the same I think.
@YWT said:
I don't think my 8 core Xeon 5410 with 8GB RAM will be enough for MIR and VI
it will not be possible to investigate in detail on the performance of every computer/processor combination, but i'd estimate such a machine can run about 16 instruments placed on a MIR stage .... in any case it is powerfull enough for a lot of VIs ...
welcome back btw, christian
An unofficial result of a recent stress test undertaken by one of the MIR Beta testers:
Primary System: I really have not been able to stress it.128 latency: roughly 50-55 instruments @ 65-70% cpu
512 latency: 80 @ roughly 65-70%
1024: over 100 instruments @ 75%
Like Dietz, I used Perf Legato patches for each instrument. Same line with adjusted ranges. Buffer @ 1. Bringing buffer up allowed me even more cpu room to work with.
... this was on a new built-to-the-task system.
HTH,
of course much depends on processor speed ... overclocking is a science by its own ... read through various overclcocking sites and you will find suddenly you need to care about memory types and voltages, heat dissipation, BIOS settings, bus frequencies, ect.
in a nutshell: overclocking is nothing supported by VSL as hardware in general is not our business. we gladly provide information about working configurations and some insight where possible though.
in other words: to transport a ton of bricks we recommend to use a truck. maybe you could do that with your cadillac too, but do this at your own risk.
christian
Hi Christian
Do you happen to know what motherboard the dual Xeon system detailed above, which delivers such good results, is running on?
I'm ordering a system tomorrow as I've hit a capacity ceiling on our current VI machine and need to move all our Vienna stuff onto a separate system. It would be great if I could spec something that will run Mir easily.
Many thanks
Jules
INTEL S5520, Supermicro X8D, Gigabyte GA-7T - all available in several versions depending on your other needs.
again: strictly stick to the compatibility list of the mainboard when ordering memory!
be aware only 1 memory module per channel (= 3 per processor) allows 1333 - if you plan to insert more (6 per processor) you are fine with 1066 anyway.
christian
Many thanks Christian.
I suspect I'll have to go the 2GB module route (6 per processor) in order to minimize cost, and may even have to start with 1 CPU and add the 2nd when prices fall a little. Better that way than have a system with no room for 'growth'.
I'm finding that the 24GB requirement really limits spec options a little. I had an X58 system all ready to go, but I just couldn't find reasonably priced 4GB unbuffered RAM modules, and I didn't fancy maxing it out with 6x2GB modules, and then discovering it wasn't enough. 4GB ECC registered modules are a fraction of the price, meaning you can spec a Xeon system for pretty much the same cost.
I'm hoping 3 1TB drives with the VI's spread across them and a 9500GT should be ok on the HD and graphics front.
Thanks again for your help.
Jules
