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  4. panning a Baroque chamber piece

  • panning a Baroque chamber piece

    J
    J

    Hello all,

    I'm working on a Baroque chamber piece comprised of VSL's Chamber Strings, Solo Violin, and Woodwinds.  My background is in piano so I don't know much about instrument placement for a chamber orchestra.  Could somebody please give me pointers on where to pan each section/instrument.  Is it relative to a large orchestra?  I don't want to start a philosophical discussion about Baroque period music but I read somewhere that since the continuo was the nucleus of the orchestra at that time the instruments performing it were placed in the middle of the stage.  Is this so?   

    One other thing.  I understand that the strings were tuned differently during that time period.  Could somebody please tell me how the strings should be tuned to reflect that time period.  What value. 

    Incidently, I won't be using a harpsichord, lute or recorders for this piece as I don't have any good sounding samples for those instruments.
  • Beat KaufmannB
    Beat KaufmannB
    last edited
    last edited

    Hello Jasensmith

    Common at that periode was

    W o o d w i n d s

    Violas Cellos/DB

    Violins 1 Harpsi Violins 2

    a' = 415 Hz (a half tone below the a' of today)

    So it would be nice to play the woodwinds in a farther depth than the strings.

    Listen to this as an eaxample (Woodwinds at 1:00 - ...)

    Even if the harpsi can be so prominent in front (as soloist) I would place it (acoustically) in the back - somewhere between

    the Cellos and the woodwinds.I often select the farther depth for it because it sounds closer than other instruments.

    Its bright sound seems to feel it close.

    Here you will find some Baroque Music (E-Music) with Harpsi Chord as part of the "Continuo".

    And another link:

    http://www.beat-kaufmann.com/extras/index.php#04391999f613b9323

    Best

    Beat

    - Tips & Tricks while using Samples of VSL.. see at: https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/vitutorials/ - Tutorial "Mixing an Orchestra": https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/mixing-an-orchestra/
  • J
    J

    Hey Beat,

    Better late than never I guess but thank you very much for this information as it is very useful.  I'll keep a hard copy filed away.  Unfortunately, I left the forum before your response so I ended up taking my piece in another direction instead of Baroque. 

    When you say farther depth for the woodwinds do you mean more reverb as in positioning them further back in the orchestra or just bringing their volume down in the mix? 

    Thanks again

    Jasen
  • Beat KaufmannB
    Beat KaufmannB
    last edited
    last edited

    @jasensmith said:

    ...When you say farther depth for the woodwinds do you mean more reverb as in positioning them further back in the orchestra or just bringing their volume down in the mix? 

    Thanks again

    Jasen

    Hi Jasen

    I assume you are using a reverb for your mix.

    1. Use the same reverb as you have taken for the strings section.

    2. Open a second instance and turn the balance in favour of a little more "wet" than you have done it for the strings.

    3. In addition to this you can cut the high frequencies a little bit > This cutting of high frequencies happens in reality by the air. 

        Try this effect (EQ) until you believe the effect supports the feeling of distance.

    4. and last but not least keep the stereo withness for the woodwinds smaller than those with the strings (the farther the mono)

        Do this narrowing with the sum of the woodwinds  and route the signal into "the woodwind reverb".

    That's it

    All the best

    Beat

    - Tips & Tricks while using Samples of VSL.. see at: https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/vitutorials/ - Tutorial "Mixing an Orchestra": https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/mixing-an-orchestra/
  • J
    J

    Beat, your posts, not to mention your orchestrations, are very enlightening as always. 

    Thank you again.

    Jasen 
  • B
    B

    Beat, regarding point 1: Do you mean use seperate instances of the same reverb for both sections, or to run both sections through the same instance?

    I.e.

    a) Reverb applied to Stings and then another reverb (but the same IR, settings) applied to Winds?, or

    b) Reverb set up, run both Strings and Winds through it.

    Thanks,

    Robert.
  • Beat KaufmannB
    Beat KaufmannB
    last edited
    last edited

    @Robert Munnelly said:

    Beat, regarding point 1: Do you mean use seperate instances of the same reverb for both sections, or to run both sections through the same instance?

    I.e.

    a) Reverb applied to Stings and then another reverb (but the same IR, settings) applied to Winds?, or

    b) Reverb set up, run both Strings and Winds through it.

    Thanks,

    Robert.

    Hi Robert

    There are two main procedures of using the reverb effect:

    1. Use the reverb as a Send Effect. That means: Use the same instance for both - strings and woodwinds - by changing the amount of "Send".

    2. Use two instances - each with the same IR but with different depths - and run the strings and woodwinds through the corresponding depth.

    I prefere the second solution because you can create more different depths than with No 1.

    Unfortunately it is less "CPU-friendly".

    Best

    Beat Kaufmann

    - Tips & Tricks while using Samples of VSL.. see at: https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/vitutorials/ - Tutorial "Mixing an Orchestra": https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/mixing-an-orchestra/
  • B
    B

    That's what I thought. Thank's Beat :)