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  4. AV, VE, Tails, Busses and a whole load of what nots!

  • AV, VE, Tails, Busses and a whole load of what nots!

    J
    J
    Hello A few basic questions but I'd really appreciate some advice. Firstly I'm curious to know if people are inserting AV into the VE or their DAW's. Personally I find on my G5 if I use too many AV instances with the VE then everything goes a bit tits up..... I'm still trying to come to terms with Pre-delays, busses and Tails etc. Am I right in thinking that you cant put AV onto a Bus Pre fader in the VE? If this is true then I'm left with using AV in Logic but how do you send the output from a midi track to a Bus. This was easily accomplished when using the VI's because they were Audio Instrument tracks. Now it's a Multi Instrument this seems a lot harder. Perhaps I'm getting unnecessarily confused here but if someone could shed some light on it that would be a great help. Many Thanks Jim
  • H
    H
    Yeah this has a few people scratching their heads. It seems that it's easier with other DAW's cos they're better at integrating external stuff, at least that's what I've read. I think you probably need to use a program link Audio Jack .. or one of those to route your VE audio back into Logic. Personally I find it all a pain in the ass so I'm still using the VI's .. as much as I would like to use VE it's just not easy to figure out how it works.
  • J
    J

     Thanks hetoreyn.  Shame there isn't really a simple solution coz I do like using the VE but I want to expeiment more with Altiverb and it's proving tricky to combine the two in certain ways.  I have to say some instructions on how to use the VE might have been nice from the Vienna team.  I had to read the manual for the Stylus RMX from Spectrasonics to find out how the VE worked!

    Cheers for your help Jim 
  • H
    H
    Well VE 3 should solve quite a few problems so you shouldn't write off VE just yet. It's just with my current system and configuration I can't get it to do anything that I can't already achieve with the VI's. But when it goes 64 bit then I think it may be a different story.
  • B
    B

    Would this work?

    1) Create a Multi-Instrument name VE1 in the Environment Window

    2) Connect the Multi-Instrument VE1 to Instrument Track 1 in the Environment Window

    3) Setup individual VE1 Midi Tracks for each channel (16 channels available) in the Arrange Window

    4) Load VE as an input plugin on Instrument Track 1

    5) Setup VE plugin with inputs from VE1 (16 channels available)

    6) Bus Instrument Track 1 output to Bus 1

    7) Load Altiverb on Bus 1

    Just curious if this might work, I'm not sure myself if it would.

    Thanks, Brian 
  • H
    H
    Sounds like it would work .. problem is that I'd need to load 2 VE's instances to cover all the stuff I use .. at least. From what I'm told that may crash Logic .. although I haven't tried it so I don't know. 16 Channels just isn't enough.
  • J
    J

    Hi there!  Cheers for all this guys.  Brian, this does work but as Hetoreyn says it only works for that VE instance.  So if you wanted to have say Brass and Strings going through a different Bus then yo'd need two VE's which would be a bit cumbersome. 

    I cant believe there isn't a way to route a MIDI channel through a Bus in logic?  I'm going to do something I've never doen before.... read the reference manual. Ugh!

    Jim 
  • B
    B

    Sorry it didn't help guys. I'm not fully aware of all the issues regarding VE, but wanted to try and help. [:)]

    hetoreyn - Well if VE2 crashes when more than one instance is created in Logic, then VE2 is probably not working correctly which makes me think it really is "beta" software even though VSL doesn't label it as such.  Like you said I'm sure these problems will be fixed in VE3 because VSL appears to have a price tag on VE3.  Like you, I still use VI.  I feel that VE2 is still a little too buggy for me, but I'm sure VE3 will be fantastic.  Also, I do my work on one machine so I wouldn't be able to make use of VE's audio data over LAN feature, which to me seems like VE's real advantage to users because it greatly simplifies the farm setup.

    Jim - I think I see what you are talking about, do you mean you want the individual instruments in VE to be bused to different locations?  I don't see how busing midi channels would do anything since midi data is only a set of instructions and doesn't actually produce any sound.  It seems to me that as long as the each midi channel is reaching the appropriate instrument in VE, then the audio output from those instruments in VE is what requires busing into Altiverb, not the individual midi channels.  Maybe I'm totally off on this, but I think that's right?  If VE doesn't offer you this kind of flexibility then there is always VI, although I can see how it might be nice to be able to bus the individual VI's in VE to different locations in your sequencer.

    Brian 
  • H
    H
    Thanks for the ideas anyways Brian. Guess we're just at the limits of the tech right now and have to wait for the newer versions. By the way, AV just released 6.1.2 .. which actually remembers the preset settings :D .. I urge everyone to update and save yourself the load up headaches of 6.1.1
  • J
    J
    Hi Brian Yep you got it really. When I was using VI's in audio instrument channels I could send to different busses in groups. Now with the VE because my midi info is on a midi channel instead of an Audio Instrument there are no sends. I could send through the channels of the VE but a) you cant send to a Bus Pre-fader and b) if you add too many AV instances Logic dies. Hope that makes sense I'm not really up on the technical jargon. Cheers for all your advice Jim
  • H
    H
    Hmmm .. I have Cubase 4.1 lying around ... I wonder if this will work any better :P .. Anyone know the procedures for setting up 2 or 3 VE's on Cubase.
  • H
    H
    I dunno. I just tried to do something as simple as make a VE instance in logic .. I can't for the life of me figure it out. How the hell do you get new midi channels up. Made my VE multi instrument .. all it did was do nothing :P .. This is why I hate Logic. Too damned complicated for those that no nothing about electronic routing. Does anyone have a Logic template with all this VE none sense set up already. Cos I'm about ready to through my PC out of the window .... well I wouldn't through my Mac .. to expensive :D But the PC can pay.
  • J
    J
    Hey! If this doesn't help you'll have to do what I did and use the manual for a completely different piece of software! I'm not in front of Logic at the moment so I cant quite remember the main details but.... Create the multi instrument in the environment. Drag the cable from it to an audio instrument channel. It will come up with a message about removing cables or something, just click remove. Activate all the channels on the multi instrument (or as many as you need) by clicking the numbers 1-16. Select the audio instrument you plugged the MI into and in the parameters box on the left make sure midi channels are set to ALL. Name the MultI instrument VE and the audio instrument track something else like... VSL Now go to the arrange page. On the audio instrument channel you chose which should be called VSL load the VE instance. On the tracks below click on them so you bring up the list of possible track options and in there you should see VE with 16 tracks available (or the amount you set up.) And that should be it. With each Vienna Instrument instance in the VE you have to set up the corresponding midi channel. I hope this helps. I don't really know what I'm doing but it works for me. Sorry if this seems completely basic. Cheers Jim