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  3. My first steps with VSL

  • My first steps with VSL

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    [H] I did receive VSL last Wednesday . The first two days I copied the samples to my HD’s and did try to organize and study the package. After feeling having a rough knowledge about what’s it is all about, I did try to experiment while doing a little MIDI mock-up of the first movements Mussorgsky-Ravels “Picture of an Exhibition”. Today I did put on my webpage http://www.iwanroth-sax.com/text/Studio-E.htm It is necessary to scroll down to be able to see it. It is 1’37 long and 2.2 MB big. If some of you would like to listen to it and give me some comments, this would be great.

    Thanks

    Iwan
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    Hi Iwan,

    I've just listened to your 'Pictures' demo. The brass was really convincing - did you use the performance set? I felt that the strings and woodwind let the recording down - what did you use for these?

    I also noticed that you use a Mac for Logic and a PC for Giga. Were you a Mac user before buying Giga and have you experienced any problems with using a PC?

    Andy.
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    Hi Andy,

    Thank you for listening and for your - very good- comments!


    [quote]
    [][/I've just listened to your 'Pictures' demo. The brass was really convincing - did you use the performance set? I felt that the strings and woodwind let the recording down - what did you use for these? ]

    I agree 100% with you. I am satisfied with the brass, woodwinds not really and strings not at all. Only the solo trumpet is from the performance set. All other instruments, brass, wood and strings are from the cube. I am now trying to do a version with strings from the performance set in order to see if I can make it sound better. Concerning the woodwinds, I honestly think this is the weak point of the library. Not the recording or sampling technique but simply the sounds of the players. This is of course only my opinion and also a matter of taste.

    But of course I do use this library only for less than a week, so lets wait and see. But feedback is important!

    [/
    I also noticed that you use a Mac for Logic and a PC for Giga. Were you a Mac user before buying Giga and have you experienced any problems with using a PC?
    ]
    Yes I was a Mac only user until Gigastudio. Yes, from my own experience I had much more problems with the PC as with the Mac. But now I bought a new MAC G4 Dual 1.25 MH and it is terribly noisy. Fortunately I do have a separate room for the computers because otherwise it would not be possible to use the machine.

    Iwan
    http://www.iwanroth-sax-com
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    WOW! as luck may have it, I just downloaded the real thing from classical archieves (prs.net) a few nights ago. Although the real one doesn't mention if it's Ravel's version or not. But one couldn't help but compare.... one differance is: their opening horn melody is played an octave lower. other than that you can't tell them apart from fake or real! I think this is a huge plus for VSL! It's so nice to be able to compare VSL with something real.


    Thanks


    Aaron Dirk
    NGS West
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    Hi Aaron,

    Thanks for listening!

    If its a horn -and not a trumpet- at the beginning, then it must an other orchestration? This with the octave sounds strange to me, because the piece is written originaly for piano AND IN THE OCTAVE OF MY LITTLE MOCK-UP. Could you let me know where you did hear this?

    Thanks

    Iwan
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    I'm only familiar with the piano version, it's one of my favorites. The other day was the first time I really heard the whole orchestrated version, even though I was aware of Ravel's version. My thought was to do a mock up of both versions. both versions can fit on a CD. I would also like to do both versions of Rachmaninoff's Symphonic Dances, but I haven't found the full score yet.

    "Pictures" is at at http://www.classicalarchives.com/main-m.html
    you'll have to scroll down to the Mu....
    It doesn't mention if it's Ravel's version. But they play the opening with horns an octave lower then your trumpet. I think I like your trumpets better. It sounds more truer to the piano version. Is this Ravel's version? I haven't picked up the score yet....

    Good job on your mock up! Do you plan on doing the whole version?


    Aaron Dirk
    NGS West
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    Iwan,

    It would be interesting to compare this recording with another version that uses the Performance Set for Strings (that was a hint [[;)]] ). I would hope the change would be quite dramatic.

    Thanks Iwan for making this VSL realization available as it helps us potential customer make the choice that you have already made.

    Craig Duke
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    I did a second version with the performance strings. This is not the same MIDI file, but is played (nothing written in) again, only the strings of course. It could be of interest to compare the two. On the Cube strings I did use EQ, but not on the performance set. It is just under the first one

    http://www.iwanroth-sax.com/text/Studio-E.htm


    I plan to make a WebPages where interested people can show off theyÕre production for a certain time. Would this be of interest? Commercial demos are often only showing what a library can do very well, and with HI TECH equipment, but this is not always what the user can or want to achieve.

    I would consider doing the whole Pictures, but right now about one third of the necessary instruments and articulation are missing in the VSL library for this purpose.

    Iwan
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    Thanks again for these posts. The facts that you "casually" played in the notes and haven't, I suspect, tweaked the midi much, gives a kind of worst-case, out-of-the-box look at VSL.

    The Performance Set strings do sound much better don't you think?

    At 00:32, in the rising violin eighth note pattern, you can hear a swell in the start of each violin note (not good) though similar eighth note patterns are much smoother. Do you hear this? Could it be that you performed these notes a bit late and my ear is being fooled? Do you have any reverb on the strings Iwan?

    Are there any parameters that can be adjusted for legato performances (I don't own VSL - yet) or is everything fixed?

    At 00:08, in the left channel, there is an instrument that sound like quarter note buzzing. Is this the attack of a Trombone with the rest of its sounds masked (unless there is a kazoo part I don't know about :wink[:)]?

    BTW, I enjoyed listening to your Saxophone Concerto.
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    wow. That sounds great Iwan. Congrats.

    Let me give ya my rookie opinion. Those brass as mentioned were truly excellent. Very lifelike. I could tell the trumpet player was called Harry, so close he seemed to be [:D]

    Now, unless my memory fails I also recall hearing this piece with a horn instead of a trumpet, so yeah, there must be an alternative orchestration for this.

    The only thing that worried me is the strings for one reason. The sound is ok to me, but the attack seems a bit delayed, specifically at 1:10 was a bit too noticiable for me. Also at the very end chords they sounded a bit sinthy. I was looking for this because it´s a problem quite common for me with other libs.
    But as you said, it could also be that you don´t have enough experience with VSL yet.

    Good job.
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    Csduke –Netvudu,

    Thanks to both of you for listening

    [<The Performance Set strings do sound much better don't you think? <]

    Yes, but not for everything. It is necessary to have both, the cube and performance. Today I did another exempt from the Pictures and I had no success at all with the performance strings,

    [/<Are there any parameters that can be adjusted for legato performances (I don't own VSL - yet) or is everything fixed! <

    As I did write, I am completely new to VSL, so I discover new things every minute and there are many things in the performance tool which I do not know by now. I am sure it will be possible to do much better. This is a huge library and despite the fact that it is not really difficult to use, it will take quite some time to use all the potential included. At least for me.

    [< Now, unless my memory fails I also recall hearing this piece with a horn instead of a trumpet, so yeah, there must be an alternative orchestration for this. <]

    Yes, there is another orchestration, but it is not played very often, but it is also very good. It is from a Russian, I do not remember the name, but I can look.

    Thanks again for your comments. It is very useful to have some more ears [:)] and if there is some of your stuff to which I can listen, please let me know

    Iwan