I wish someone would dig up a genious or two to help us make the right decision.
Unfortunately there is no right decision, except in the eyes of the beholder [*-)]
DG
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Mac guy here again--
I do agree that Apple has fed its improvements in conspicuously small increments. Besides the "cute factor" and improved RAM and bus speeds, the benefits tend to taper off. However, respective new teething periods for both Mac and PC's will be in progress for a while and in earnest.
The cost factor with PC's has been very tempting for me-- plus the plethora of software choices places the best that PC's have to offer a bit ahead of Apple in comparable areas. Options for surround mixing are a prime example. (Remember-- this is a Mac guy saying this.)
But in general, the grass is not *that much* greener when all is said and done. Issues abound on both sides of the farm yard fence-- as do benefits. At present, there is less reason for PC and Mac users in general to switch platforms, although electronic musicians have clear reasons to consider all of the available options for production tools, including having at least one computer of each platform.
As for notation-- no DAW cuts it in this area, and having used them all I got on the Finale bandwagon quite early on. I would never place anything printed out from a DAW in front of professional musicians. Maybe that's just me.
But back to VSL and LAPTOPS-- we ask a lot of our systems and are always asking more of them than they are prepared to handle. Whether PC or Mac, the main issue here is not to expect to get dozens of instances running smoothly. Depending upon the amount of samples loaded at once, I'd say that 10-12 instances are reasonable. In truth, regardless of platform, VI is a serious tool for serious production requiring serious horsepower. For my laptop while traveling, I'm using Miroslav Philharmonik's 7 GB library and am treading carefully (albeit on a G4 1.5Ghz 17" PB). It's not a question of which library I like better-- it's a question of being realistic with hardware and software compatibility.
It should also be noted that Paul's stress tests were just that-- 'stress' tests. I don't view them as average setups, and therefore pragmatic thinking calls for a measure of modesty in real world implementation. For example: will I be able to load 24 instances on my G5 2.5 dual tower? Probably, but I don't dare hit the space bar!!
Dunno. I'd say if you're on PC, stay with PC. If you're on a Mac, stay with Mac. The pros and cons on each abound.
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As for notation-- no DAW cuts it in this area, and having used them all I got on the Finale bandwagon quite early on. I would never place anything printed out from a DAW in front of professional musicians. Maybe that's just me.
Yes Its just you. JWL You're a perfectionist and plenty of energy to boot, obviously.
Must be nice. thanks for the info by the way. Its is very helpfull.
I'm getting ready to publish 2 books with logic's score. Have I used the notation programs, they would have control over final say so & any lengthy piece. I don't like that. The ease of factor is essencial. But I can see your point JWL, you want to please your clients.
I usually have to kiss everyone's ass to eventually let them know the real world.
Exsuse the foul language, its just an expression of use. Do people know how much time and money is spent here. As Alex stated it correctly. Clients that are new, have no Idea. there is the story of the director who wanted a clarinet part in his score so he told the composer that he wanted that thing that is played by soft ect... He had no idea what a clarinet is. on and on ..there's stories that make one laugh. I'm afraid I have also contributed to the laughter factor also. So and so......
Hey Alex : my logic score page brings me a beer, when I press control/ shift/Command.
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Thanks again everyone for the advice.
While all this brain power is flying around, I thought I might plug my question from another thread:
I had 3 instances of VI running, crashed the ASIO, and since, no VST VI anymore, even though its in the folder. Logic just doesn't 'see' it. ??
My system is almost famous by now, but just FYI: 2.4Ghz PC, Logic 5.5, 1GB... BTW, I just bought 2GB of ram for my laptop (designed to take 1, Crucial Memory says, hey, why not try it?).
Right now, I'm leaning towards Cubase - if I get frustrated, I'm just going to plunk down 1g and get a mini-tower with a 2.8GHZ pentium-D and 2GB ram.
Anyone got comments on how good the scoring is in Cubase? We've heard a lot about Logic...
Best regards,
Eric
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RK dear fellow!
I'm shocked at this! Logic, good in the score department? When you can't even play in the notes, unless you're in the arrange window? Where correcting the odd mistake calls for restructuring a bar, semiquaver by semiquaver?
If anyone is interested, it is perfectly possible to get Logic to emulate note input a la Finale or Sibelius, with a combination of the onscreen Keyboard, the score window and some keyboard shortcuts.
Regards
David Hage
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I'm still leaning back to a PC farm, sample libraries, and Cubase, when i return to Europe and invest in a bigger setup (yet another one!). At least there i can manipulate the score a little easier, and if i'm going to spend a lot of money buying new samples, i'm fairly convinced the difference in performance between MAC vs PC is not worth the hype or difference in price.
Shame really, because EXS, pound for pound, is the bright spot in the Emagic/Inteligapple/VI scenario. A simple sample player/editor that handles resource well.
It is a bit ironic that we're discussing a basic task, inputting, we're almost agreed on the general pittance that is available for those who prefer the notes in front of them, with equipment running into the thousands of dollars, programs just as comparatively expensive, with multi level complexity that are trained to market themselves as sit up and do as told, and valuable time spent doing all this with stuff that simply doesn't cut it.
I find that wistfully amusing......[*-)]
Alex.
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@hermitage59 said:
I'm still leaning back to a PC farm, sample libraries, and Cubase, when i return to Europe and invest in a bigger setup (yet another one!). At least there i can manipulate the score a little easier, and if i'm going to spend a lot of money buying new samples, i'm fairly convinced the difference in performance between MAC vs PC is not worth the hype or difference in price.
Shame really, because EXS, pound for pound, is the bright spot in the Emagic/Inteligapple/VI scenario. A simple sample player/editor that handles resource well.
Alex.
I think that if you intend to make a go of the whole Vienna VI thing then it won't really matter what you get, as (assuming that the current Mac problems disappear) both Mac and PC will work well.
I'm in a holding pattern until Vista, so my "farm" is likely to be increased by another PC in the near future. However, as it is all running via FX-Teleport I have no soundcards or MIDI interfaces/cables to worry about, and it should cost round about £400. Not bad for a machine that will handle 2.8Gb of samples [H]
DG
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Yes Its just you. JWL You're a perfectionist and plenty of energy to boot, obviously.
Must be nice. thanks for the info by the way. Its is very helpfull.
I'll take these as positives... I think...
Don't know how helpful I've been if you think I'm swimming alone in this regard, but good luck on your book.
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Yes Its just you. JWL You're a perfectionist and plenty of energy to boot, obviously.
Must be nice. thanks for the info by the way. Its is very helpfull.
I'll take these as positives... I think...
Don't know how helpful I've been if you think I'm swimming alone in this regard, but good luck on your book.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, "Sequencer notation is CR*P!!!"
DG
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@hermitage59 said:
I'm still leaning back to a PC farm, sample libraries, and Cubase, when i return to Europe and invest in a bigger setup (yet another one!). At least there i can manipulate the score a little easier, and if i'm going to spend a lot of money buying new samples, i'm fairly convinced the difference in performance between MAC vs PC is not worth the hype or difference in price.
Shame really, because EXS, pound for pound, is the bright spot in the Emagic/Inteligapple/VI scenario. A simple sample player/editor that handles resource well.
Alex.
I think that if you intend to make a go of the whole Vienna VI thing then it won't really matter what you get, as (assuming that the current Mac problems disappear) both Mac and PC will work well.
I'm in a holding pattern until Vista, so my "farm" is likely to be increased by another PC in the near future. However, as it is all running via FX-Teleport I have no soundcards or MIDI interfaces/cables to worry about, and it should cost round about £400. Not bad for a machine that will handle 2.8Gb of samples [H]
DG
And it's partly your success with FX teleport and the favourable comments you made about it that has got me thinking, Daryl.
Your end result is scarcely different in terms of output and RAM usage to a setup with more expensive kit (Mac), and as i've used Cubase, Logic, and Sibelius fairly regularly, the learning curve isn't as big an issue. I agree with the holding on for Vista, something i'd do anyway while i'm still here, and of course there's the potential of MIR.
I have an OT question at this point. Are you using Cubase in conjunction with Nuendo and Gigastudio, or do you have something else?
Alex.
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@hermitage59 said:
I have an OT question at this point. Are you using Cubase in conjunction with Nuendo and Gigastudio, or do you have something else?
Alex.
I use Nuendo, GS3 and K2 (pause for spitting). I will probably be retiring GS for the VST version at some point, as it doesn't really like to play with Vienna VI on the same PC. I don't use Cubase or ProTools any more, as Nuendo covers all of that ground and more.
DG
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@hermitage59 said:
I have an OT question at this point. Are you using Cubase in conjunction with Nuendo and Gigastudio, or do you have something else?
Alex.
I use Nuendo, GS3 and K2 (pause for spitting). I will probably be retiring GS for the VST version at some point, as it doesn't really like to play with Vienna VI on the same PC. I don't use Cubase or ProTools any more, as Nuendo covers all of that ground and more.
DG
Daryl,
I didn't know Nuendo covered all the Cubase workings as well. Anyway, I've just downloaded the manual and presentation PDF, so i'll have a browse.
Thanks for the info,
Alex.
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Yes Its just you. JWL You're a perfectionist and plenty of energy to boot, obviously.
Must be nice. thanks for the info by the way. Its is very helpfull.
I'll take these as positives... I think...
Don't know how helpful I've been if you think I'm swimming alone in this regard, but good luck on your book.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, "Sequencer notation is CR*P!!!"
DG
JWL
Yes of-course I meant it as a compliment.
And DG, is cubases notation that bad !! I had no Idea.
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I skimmed this thread and didn't see anyone mention that there's no such thing as IRQ on a Mac, nor is there BIOS. Intel Macs have the next thing after BIOS, whatever it's called, but as far as I know you don't have to use it (anymore than you have to use the terminal and fool around with Unix nonsense).