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  • books

    Greetings,
    Somebody recommended me to look at Beat Kauffman's tutorials and I found them very helpful, but i was wondering if any of you know of any good books dealing with mixing, EQing and post-production that you would recommend. I've never read anything of the sort, and I basically just do what I do "by ear" but would love to learn. Thanks!

  • Thanks Tanuj,
    There sure seems to not be a whole lot of books around concerning this topic. As of now, you have been the only that has replied... I wonder if most everybody else just learns this stuff at school, but even then they would have a textbook that they could recommend...
    Thank you for your suggestion. And since you are new at this as well, perhaps somebody else might decide to recommend more books that could help us.

    Regards,
    J Marcos

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    @J Marcos said:

    Thanks Tanuj,
    There sure seems to not be a whole lot of books around. As of now, you have been the only that has replied. I wonder if most everybody else just learns this stuff at school, but even then they would have a textbook that they could recommend...
    Thank you for your suggestion. And since you are new at this as well, perhaps somebody else might decide to recommend more books that could help us.

    Regards,
    J Marcos


    I'm afraid that most people learn this stuff by asking stupid questions here, at least that's how I learned [:D] I don't know of any text books although there are people on this forum who should write one. Mostly it is trial and error I think. However, don't be afraid to ask questions; if nobody can give you an answer at least you are no worse off than before.

    One of the best resources is the Tutorials by Beat Kauffman. Make sure that you go through all of these, and not just once.

    DG

  • Fortunately, or unfortunately, the process is a combination of personal experience gained through a lot of trial and error, and asking for opinions on your efforts, and studying other peoples' work and asking them how they achieved their results. Many have totally different ways of acheiving similar goals. In some ways, real life mixing jobs (with real live recorded instruments) demonstrate parallels, but in many ways, the VSL process is very different. I am still unsatisfied with many of my results, but am coming to terms with the following revelation:

    The better my arrangement before I touch any reverb settings, the better it will sound in reverb. If your original dry VSL arrangement sounds like a fairground organ, adding reverb will only exacerbate the situation. Reverb is not to the VSL man what grouting is to a tiler! Reverb will not fix poor quality VSL orchestration. I don't care how good the reverb quality is - mud is mud. If this idea disturbs you, think of rehearsing the Vienna Phil in a school hall. The sound will be dry and a little boxy, but still rather good. Then transfer them to a nice sounding space for the concert and PRESTO!

    Thus, a lot of people here are not actually suffering from post-production and mix problems, but from not having spent enough attention to detail at a pre-production level, or even (in the nicest possible way) lack some experience in basic music harmony, theory and orchestration. Combining technology with music is asking a fair amount from one brain. Many musicians I know are purists and don't even have a computer. Others have embraced technology in their own way, and are making it work for them.

    Study scores, ask questions, listen to classical recordings of orchestras, and then take a step back and see if your stuff is close. This is of course assuming you are happy with the level of your knowledge of VSL from a technial point of view. But don't ever lose sight of the fact that, in spite of the frustrations you might encounter, this is all SUCH FUN! We are playing God with musicians and instruments at our beck and call. We musn't forget to enjoy while work.

  • Thanks DG and rawmusic.
    I checked about the book vibrato recommended but it was not in the library here, and I don't have $70 dollars to spare at this point (to buy it)... [:(]
    I am quite eager to learn (too eager?), and asking around seems such a slow way to do it, but if there's no other way...
    I don't mind asking, and showing my ignorance [:)] People here have been quite friendly and helpful. I just hate to take people's time with basic questions...
    rawmusic, I do feel quite confident in music theory, and i feel ok about orchestration. Got good grades at both, though I don't have extensive experience with orchestration. I have done lots of reading as far as theory goes though, and taken most every class that is offered at school....
    I suppose the ideal scenario would be some sort of apprenticeship with a good sound engineer or something... but I am still at school and I work on the side... so that's not an option at this point.
    If you ever run across a book, website or anything that might speed up the process for learning post-production, do tell me, please. It will be very much appreciated.

    Thanks for your time!

    Regards,

    J Marcos

  • Here's some advice that doesn't often come up in these kinds of questions. To learn to mix an orchestra, you need to budget some time and money to attend as many live performances as you can, regardless of whether you like what's on the program for the evening. To do so is to train your ears so you know where things sound, at what dynamic levels, etc.

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    @J Marcos said:

    I was wondering if any of you know of any good books dealing with mixing, EQing and post-production that you would recommend. I've never read anything of the sort, and I basically just do what I do "by ear" but would love to learn. Thanks!

    Hello J Marcos
    There are a lot of books.
    Here is a link. Go through the list of 132 books...
    http://www.bestprices.com/cgi-bin/vlink/book_by_keywords?category=Music&keywords=Electronic&id=fxtgXony

    For German speaking people:
    http://www.musica.at/musikbuecher/index6.htm

    The best book... [8-)]


    Beat Kaufmann

    - Tips & Tricks while using Samples of VSL.. see at: https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/vitutorials/ - Tutorial "Mixing an Orchestra": https://www.beat-kaufmann.com/mixing-an-orchestra/
  • One of the less "middle of the road" mixing-books is Mike Stavrou's "Mixing With Your Mind". While it is not exactly aimed at orchestral mixing, he has a refreshing, undogmatic (and not necessarily technical) point of view. Definetly worth reading.

    -> http://www.mixingwithyourmind.com/preview_intro.htm

    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • Thaks Peter, that sounds like a good idea. Actually I was in a recording studio yesterday recording a girl with your last name =) Great singer (but the orchestral track had been prerecorded)! I was in the cabin. The engineer won't do the mixing until maybe 2 weeks from now, too busy...

    Beat, Wow!!! A list of 132 books! The tricky thing is to know which ones would be best. Sorry but no sprachest deutch, or something like that... [:(] but hablo EspaƱol...I doubt that helps as far as mixing. Thanks for the list, that's awesome!

    Wow Dietz, if the book is half as good as they say it is, it would be worth it! Marketing techniques are so deceitful, though...but I trust you. That sounds like an excellent book. I'll check it out.

    Thanks!!
    JM

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    @J Marcos said:

    [...] Wow Dietz, if the book is half as good as they say it is, it would be worth it! Marketing techniques are so deceitful, though...but I trust you. That sounds like an excellent book. I'll check it out.

    Thanks!!
    JM

    Yes, the homepage makes a little bit too much hype about the book, I know. But it's really a nice textbook; you will miss hard facts, though, like formulas or scientific diagrams. It's the ideal "second opinion", I'd say.

    HTH,

    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • I'd also have to recommend Dave Moulton's "Total Recording" - www.KIQproductions.com.

    Disclaimer: I edited it. But I wouldn't recommend it if it weren't good. It's not a cookbook for mixing, but rather a general forest-over-trees approach to audio - and psychoacoustics, and all kinds of other things.

  • Guys this is awesome!! You are great! Blessings and more blessings on you. Now is time to save money to buy the books =)
    Thanks a lot!

    JM