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  • No differentiated criticism, just pure raving: MIR Pro 3D is the best software I have ever bought!

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    I know odes don't help anyone, but I have to vent my joy about the purchase of MIR Pro 3D I made in September 2023, but let me start from the beginning:

    Prologue
    From September 2017 to August 2023, I studied film music (I won't say where at this point, as I haven't yet decided how anonymous I want to be in this forum) and graduated with a Bachelor of Music. This official degree programme had been preceded by an unofficial two-year pre-study programme in which I had acquired basic music production skills with a focus on MIDI programming, among other things; it was virtually tailor-made for the Bachelor's degree programme. Before these two years of preparation, I had never heard the term "DAW" or "sequencer", let alone touched such software. Ironically, I had already heard the name "Cubase", because this software had once been mentioned, resp. shown in an old documentary about Hans Zimmer, but I had not known what the general name for such a programme is. Since the main lecturer of the preparatory course was a fan of Pro Tools, which was still available for purchase at the time and not just for subscription, he recommended that all his students buy this DAW if they weren't already using (another) one. I followed this and his recommendation to buy Native Instruments' Komplete bundle to get started. He, who was also a big fan of VSL, always said that one day we should buy libraries from this company as he thought they were the best on the market. We naïve beginners seriously thought he was kidding us because we kids of our time adored the sound of Spitfire Audio and Orchestral Tools, which we thought sounded the most "Hollywood". How embarrassing one can be...

    Main story
    For a long time during my studies, five years to be precise, I continued to think along similar lines, but in the meantime I bought the piccolo trumpet, the solo Wagner tuba, the concert guitar, the bass waterphone, as well as the timpani, gongs and tam-tams. I bought the first two libraries because I really like the timbres and am particularly fond of the Wagner tuba. Strangely enough, the purchase of all the products just mentioned made me doubt the quality of VSL even more, because I struggled to get them "wet". To anticipate: only after those five years did I realise what the important (!!!) difference between algorithmic and convolution reverb is! How stupid can one be? Is that even legal? Until then, I had always thought that the only difference was that the latter corresponded to real rooms. It only dawned on me so late that you can't get the "dryness" out of samples with algorithmic reverb. How much can one live under a rock and ignore reality? But back to the time before the enlightening realisation: out of desperation, I even bought the pro version of Vienna Instruments (yes, you still had to pay for it in the old days), which of course didn't help because I didn't buy MIRx due to the aforementioned, but not yet received realisation and lack of budget. This led to a frustration that made me angry at VSL and inwardly accuse them of lying and making false promises. Fortunately, I never wrote an email to the poor souls at support because it would have been a hate-filled tirade. I never blamed myself because other developers' libraries sounded good when I used them... Oh boy, was I NAÏVE: how arrogant can one be, just because one can get a good, not necessarily very good, result faster with those doesn't mean one has mastered the craft!

    Well, when I finally realised that convolution reverb is needed to place dry samples/instruments in a room, I lost faith in myself. Several times I facepalmed myself because I realised my own idiocy. Accordingly, since I didn't have a convolution reverb plugin, I used to go to the university studio to add wetness to VSL's dry samples with AltiVerb. Being brought down to earth so hard made me research convolution reverb extensively. As a result, I knew that one day I would buy MIR Pro 3D, especially as I tried out the 30-day demo just over a year ago. The day of purchase was 4 September 2023.

    Ode
    After about half a year of intensive use and experimentation, I came to the conclusion: MIR Pro 3D is the best software I have ever purchased! I love the flexibility so much that I prefer to buy VI Series, "SYNCHRON-ized" libraries (can be turned dry) or both versions, although the Synchron series is also very exciting. Both samplers (Vienna Instruments Pro and Synchron Player) have their pros and cons each, but that's another topic. In the meantime, I have bought quite a few instruments and bundles. Of course, MIR Pro 3D doesn't eliminate the need for careful composition, orchestration and MIDI programming, but it "gives you the space" to achieve a perfect sound. My next goal is to purchase all the room packs one by one, since as a recent graduate I'm typically strapped for cash and could only treat myself to one as one is included for free. Making the decision here was really hard, because on one hand I think the sound of the Wiener Konzerthaus is phenomenal, on the other hand I have some libraries that were recorded at Teldex (hmm, which ones can those be🤔): do I want the fantastic sound of a world-renowned concert hall and its foyer, or do I want the VSL libraries in the same room as the others? In the end, I decided in favour of the "Studios & Stages" pack, which includes Teldex. I'm happy with the decision, although I'm still weeping after the Wiener Konzerthaus, as it also includes a few other studio rooms, which means sonic diversity.

    I love the freedom of placement, the customisation options right down to the directional characteristics of the microphones, the preset system, the parallel use of different rooms and so much more that I could go on and on here. I'll just say this much: MIR Pro 3D invites you to experiment as much as a sandbox, so that the possibilities seem endless. From a purely objective point of view, buying a DAW (then Pro Tools, now Cubase) is my most important and best purchase, because nothing works without one, but with a good portion of subjectivity and joy factored in, MIR Pro 3D is my best, most important and favourite purchase!


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    I can second that, if you spend the time and a change of your usual mixing habits (working on classic 2D stereo mixes) it is the literal white rabbit disappearing in the rabbithole in Kansas.

    Just one small thing: Add Binaural to your experiments. I bought the recommended add-on from RealVR: Beeing disappointed in the first place, I spend some (support) time with @Dietz (who is so patient, thanks a lot) and the people from RealVR to work out glitches and problems in my DAW. ("Hint: Use Headphone Profiles") And do not pass on all of the training demos from the VSL Team!

    It is first and foremost a thing of listening and learning with your ears - as in most cases in audio.

    But if you jump into that rabbithole -

    @LGeist110 said:
    love the freedom of placement, the customisation options right down to the directional characteristics of the microphones, the preset system, the parallel use of different rooms and so much more that I could go on and on here. I'll just say this much: MIR Pro 3D invites you to experiment as much as a sandbox, so that the possibilities seem endless.

    At the end, I took the plunge, had to drop Cakewalk after 10+years (which can only do "fake" surround") and jumped into Pro Tools, but the other usual DAW candidates would have done the same. For some reasons, Pro Tools was comforting, like using an old classic tape reel in the studio. Plus the new world of 3D Binaural placement and experimentation.

    What helped me tremendously in this new world was the help of the VSL support and the MIR3D examples.

    Or have you ever placed a Opera Sopranist in the Stage Cloud , the doublebass (me!) in the unlocalized deeptone middle and the whirlwind of effects in 4 corners of the stage in the Konzerthaus?

    While experimenting, I also detect the great "new" acoustic possibilities of the ORF stages.

    So nothing to add:

    @LGeist110 said:
    MIR Pro 3D is my best, most important and favourite purchase!

    Too old for Rock n Roll. Too young for 9th symphonies. Wagner Lover, IRCAM Alumni. Double Bass player starting in low Es. I am where noise is music.
  • @LGeist110 - Thanks a bunch for sharing your enthusiasm! It's great to hear that you like MIR 3D as much as we do. This means a lot to us, really!

    👍👍

    All the best & greetings from Vienna!


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • @Holgmeister said:

    I can second that, if you spend the time and a change of your usual mixing habits (working on classic 2D stereo mixes) it is the literal white rabbit disappearing in the rabbithole in Kansas.


    Just one small thing: Add Binaural to your experiments. I bought the recommended add-on from RealVR: Beeing disappointed in the first place, I spend some (support) time with @Dietz (who is so patient, thanks a lot) and the people from RealVR to work out glitches and problems in my DAW. ("Hint: Use Headphone Profiles") And do not pass on all of the training demos from the VSL Team!


    It is first and foremost a thing of listening and learning with your ears - as in most cases in audio.


    But if you jump into that rabbithole -


    @LGeist110 said:
    love the freedom of placement, the customisation options right down to the directional characteristics of the microphones, the preset system, the parallel use of different rooms and so much more that I could go on and on here. I'll just say this much: MIR Pro 3D invites you to experiment as much as a sandbox, so that the possibilities seem endless.

    At the end, I took the plunge, had to drop Cakewalk after 10+years (which can only do "fake" surround") and jumped into Pro Tools, but the other usual DAW candidates would have done the same. For some reasons, Pro Tools was comforting, like using an old classic tape reel in the studio. Plus the new world of 3D Binaural placement and experimentation.


    What helped me tremendously in this new world was the help of the VSL support and the MIR3D examples.


    Or have you ever placed a Opera Sopranist in the Stage Cloud , the doublebass (me!) in the unlocalized deeptone middle and the whirlwind of effects in 4 corners of the stage in the Konzerthaus?


    While experimenting, I also detect the great "new" acoustic possibilities of the ORF stages.



    So nothing to add:


    @LGeist110 said:
    MIR Pro 3D is my best, most important and favourite purchase!

    I've already gone down the rabbit hole of binaurality. It's one of the first aspects I tackled as I already owned Spatial Audio Designer, or SAD for short, which is similar software to DearVR. However, since there is a co-operation between VSL and the developers of the latter plugin, I am toying with the idea of buying it in a future discount campaign.


  • BenB Ben forked this topic on
  • Yeah, the longer you've had MIR, the more you like it. MIR was already my favourite bit of kit. And then MIR 3D came out...😁


  • Yeah, VSL and MIR PRO 3D certainly are top notch products in the audio industry. The very best. Like Red Bull racing! I see Dietz as the Adrian Newey of VSL. Also Austrian. VSL that is. And that from me as a Dutchman. Well there's Max of course...


  • A few things that I would like to see in MIR 3D are:

    Add a prompt when deleting a venue preset. Today I deleted a venue preset instead of saving it due to the trash can being so close to the save button.😅

    When an instrument is out of bounds, it gets greyed out in the channel list on the left. This would make it easier when switching to say a smaller venue and seeing instrument that are out of bounds without zooming out and searching behind columns and stairs for them.

    Grouping between venues. This would be nice when I would like to move two or more instruments that are in different venues simultaneously.

    Clicking on the name tag of the instrument selects the instrument.

    An option for simplified icon names to reduce clutter. like what VEP does with long names.

    A way to save/load the entire MIR 3D instance with all active venues and settings as a single file. This would make switching between multi venue setups much easier.

    Cheers,


  • @JBuck said:

    A few things that I would like to see in MIR 3D are:


    Add a prompt when deleting a venue preset. Today I deleted a venue preset instead of saving it due to the trash can being so close to the save button.😅


    When an instrument is out of bounds, it gets greyed out in the channel list on the left. This would make it easier when switching to say a smaller venue and seeing instrument that are out of bounds without zooming out and searching behind columns and stairs for them.


    Grouping between venues. This would be nice when I would like to move two or more instruments that are in different venues simultaneously.


    Clicking on the name tag of the instrument selects the instrument.


    An option for simplified icon names to reduce clutter. like what VEP does with long names.


    A way to save/load the entire MIR 3D instance with all active venues and settings as a single file. This would make switching between multi venue setups much easier.


    Cheers,

    Some really useful suggestions here! Thanks for contributing.

    I can't promise that they all will become reality, but some of them should be easy to implement. At least I'll make sure that VSL's developers take note. 😊

    Enjoy MIR 3D!


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
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    An additional note:

    @JBuck said:
    A way to save/load the entire MIR 3D instance with all active venues and settings as a single file. This would make switching between multi venue setups much easier.

    You mean like a whole server project "frame" in VE Pro? Hmmm ... I understand the reasoning behind the idea, but given that MIR 3D's Preset Manager is based on a rather unique approach with a lot of complexity as it is, I would be concerned that the concept would become hopelessly overloaded.


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • @Dietz said:
    You mean like a whole server project "frame" in VE Pro? Hmmm ... I understand the reasoning behind the idea, but given that MIR 3D's Preset Manager is based on a rather unique approach with a lot of complexity as it is, I would be concerned that the concept would become hopelessly overloaded.

    Okay, loading each venue separately is no biggie.

    Speaking of venue presets, could you please tell me where they are stored on my Windows machine?

    Cheers,


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    @JBuck said:
    Speaking of venue presets, could you please tell me where they are stored on my Windows machine?

    You can simply drag'n'drop individual presets and/or entire folders to the desktop or to any location that you have opened in the Explorer.

    EDIT: ... and vice versa, of course!!! 😊


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
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    @JBuck said:
    Add a prompt when deleting a venue preset. Today I deleted a venue preset instead of saving it due to the trash can being so close to the save button.😅

    VSL's software engineer Arjaan Auinger pointed out that there actually _is_ a warning message. You probably decided to not show it again, that's why you don't see it any longer - just like me, BTW! ;-D


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
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    So how would one go about having that message pop up again? Other software that I use operates on a per session basis. IMO this would work better. And is this for Venue presets as well as Role resets?


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    @Dietz said:
    VSL's software engineer Arjaan Auinger pointed out that there actually _is_ a warning message. You probably decided to not show it again, that's why you don't see it any longer - just like me, BTW! ;-D

    So how would one go about having that message pop up again? Other software that I use operates on a per session basis. IMO this would work better. And is this for Venue presets as well as Role presets?


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    This forum is a touch annoying in that I cannot delete posts after 2 minutes of posting it. What is that for may I ask? And I attempted to delete a post within the 2 minute deadline and got the following message:

    Error

    You do not have enough privileges for this action.


  • @JBuck said:
    @Dietz said:
    VSL's software engineer Arjaan Auinger pointed out that there actually _is_ a warning message. You probably decided to not show it again, that's why you don't see it any longer - just like me, BTW! ;-D


    So how would one go about having that message pop up again? Other software that I use operates on a per session basis. IMO this would work better. And is this for Venue presets as well as Role presets?


    The next update will offer a button in MIR's preferences to reset all "Dont's show this again" messages.


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
  • @JBuck said:

    This forum is a touch annoying in that I cannot delete posts after 2 minutes of posting it. What is that for may I ask? And I attempted to delete a post within the 2 minute deadline and got the following message:


    Error


    You do not have enough privileges for this action.

    This is how the forum admins have decided to implement the edit feature. There is a dedicated thread in the "Website" subforum on this topic already - please voice your dissatisfaction there. Thx!


    /Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library