Thanks for the insight on plugins and it is true that many do not accept MIDI preset changes. In my system, the ones that do include most of the virtual instruments such as Arturia Analog Lab, Kontakt, Reaktor, Keyscape and Omnisphere. With FX plugins they are certainly harder to find. So as a work around I am exploring the Kushview Element right now. I am wondering how that would work as a plugin within VEP7 because it would still be constrained by the issue of either being on an input bus or an instrument channel. I see that it has excellent routing capabilities in the Graph Window, for both audio and MIDI, but being embedded in an AUDIO bus, would I be able to choose an external MIDI source, or if embedded within an Instrument Channel, how could I bus audio into an input. of an FX plugin? I assume it does not operate in a standalone mode.

First let me say I greatly appreciate your knowledge and help in my quest.

I had considered Mainstage as a solution. I am running Mac OS Mojave and was thwarted at the Apple App Store when I was prevented from downloading due to my older OS. I looked for a legacy version but could not find any.  The Blue Cat Patchwork also looks promising as I can run it as a standalone version. However moving audio to and fro the DAW computer to the FX server computer via ethernet is another issue. Moving MIDI through ethernet is of course no problem. I am unfortunately not Dante compatible which would be perfect. I am exploring Sonobus right now and perhaps in tandem with Loopback I could move audio into a standalone instance of Blue Cat Patchwork or a legacy version of Mainstage. 

Thanks again!

Apple App Store strikes again..sorry to hear you can't buy MainStage...I would have thought they would let you buy the older version before they updated it to require Catalina...but doesn't surprise me that you can't buy it now unless you go to Catalina.  One thing you can do is find a friend that has Catalina installed on their Mac, log into the App Store from their computer using your Id.  Buy MainStage, then log out.  Then go back to your Mojave machine and you should be able to download the last known version of MainStage that runs on Mojave...  its a little work around.

Anyway, there is another program you can check out called Gig Performer, which is similar as MainStage, runs on Mac or windows.  Its considerably more expensive though.

As you pointed out, by going that route you will have to use some combination fo networked midi and audio, which can get expensive...

I want to say VePro has one huge advantage which is that is handles Plugin Delay compensation and will make sure that if you are playing back a project from a DAW, everything will be sample accurate.  When you go the route of using a "Live" tool like Minstage or Gig Performer..then there is no sample accuracy...but if you're live....there is no sample accuracy anyway; just unavoidable latency.

Pathchworks could work, I'm not sure if it can respond to Program change or not like that though.  Patchworks has problems running inside VePro, FYI...gui problems.

I just checked Kushview and indeed you can setup multiple "graphs".  Each graph is a cabled setup of instruments and/or FX.  And you can use Program Change to switch which graph is activated.  So you could potentially use something like that, but still you have the problem of midi and audio both getting to it in order to do that.  It can also use OSC and other things, so check with the author to find out if your need can be met inside VePro somehow.

I would do some more experiments out of curiosity, but running out the door shortly.

Networking MIDI is no problem as I am already running 5 network MIDI connections (80 MIDI channels) using Audio-MIDI setup in Mac OS. The audio is the problem.

I was able to use Sonobus to create a stereo audio send and return between the two computers, but I am not sold on the audio quality as of yet. 

Switching graphs via parameter change in Elements might work. 

I will keep experimenting.

Brilliant! Thanks!  I will try this out for the two instances of Reaktor I have going on in my FX rack.  I think there may only one, possibly two other FX plugin I use that responds to preset changes and they are both NI products that possibly could be embedded within Reaktor.   As you pointed out, many FX plugins do not support preset changes of which I may only wish to include one or two for on stage automation. So in those cases I am wondering if these individual presets could be embedded in a series of graphs that could be called up via MIDI presets.  

Kushview also reminds me of MAXmsp which was something I was considering as a solution. The learning curve seemed a bit steep so I was holding off. Kushview is less expensive and seems more focused to the task at hand. I am curious if you chose the single subscription or the ongoing $2-$5 subscription for Kushview. 

Pardon, but did you test that IAC connection to see if it passed MIDI into VEP? No matter what I do, I can't seem to get the Kushview IAC Input Device to work inside VEP. I put a MIDI monitor on my IAC port outside VEP and it is working there, but the MIDI Monitor inside VEP shows no MIDI data.  

Thanks again. I have not bought Bidule yet, but I have read something on their forum that a user was concerned about audio latency inside VEP. I was going to download a trial version but they only offer trials of standalone, and even that is not available presently. 

Out of the 5 FX loops I have integrated in my rig, two are Reaktor based. I had previously set these up with fixed multiFX processors. I have yet to get into selecting snapshots via MIDI and I am not quite sure how that is done. Selecting though parameter change may very well be the only way. Because Reaktor has numerous FX to choose from and they all seem to use snapshots, I wonder if snapshots from a variety of FX can be placed in a folder and treated more or less like a bank, so that when a snapshot is called, it loads said FX instance.  Maybe that is a stretch and something best left for a Reaktor forum, , but you seem knowledgable in this topic.

In any case, I also placed Guitar Rig and Reflektor XT in two of the other loops as well as an Arturia replication of the classic Mutron Bi-Phase as that was an instrument I had years ago that I was fond of. Using Kushman Elements I began building a  BiPhase preset list and was preparing to experiments to see if I could select those via VEP parameters while the plugin was inserted in an audio bus. Guitar Rig loaded within Elements fine and I have discovered it is a versatile multi FX processor that needn't just be used for guitar FX. So I am not just using Reaktor FX is my main point here. 

So here's another possible way to work to consider...

You could use a separate VePro instance for each "specific" FX instance..  And then in the main DAW you are using you switch which VePro plugin instance depend on however you want to do it.

For example...

let's say you have Kushview sitting as a plugin in Your DAW. (not in Vepro)  Inside that plugin you have 5 instances of VePro plugin.  Y

ou could have those in one big graph or they could each have their own graph.  Let's take the latter situation.  Inside Kushview you have 5 graphs, and each one has a single VePro Plugin, which is connected to its own devoted instance on VePro server.

Now Kushview can respond to PC messages in your DAW and that will cause the appropriate graph to be loaded, which will point to the particular VePro instance you want...

Just generally moving the ProgramChange switching out of VePro and into your DAW may open some options, so long as you don't need to a actually get more midi into the FX plugin..beyond switching the preset.  For example a few rare FX plugins use midi to manipulate their effect in real time, such as Stutter Edit.  That's a different problem.  But if you just need to be able to somehow use PC message to choose which FX preset...then perhaps by using the DAW to switch which VePro instance its routing through..you can accomplish that.

just thinking out of the box...

An interesting approach to be sure. I do run each FX in different instances already. I will contemplate your idea and I am not against letting go of structure that I have already created if it works better. Switching graphs does offer some possibilities. In one of the images I posted earlier, you can see that the FX mixer allows me to chain FX loops in a variety of ways, although this is overkill given that I am using multiFX processing on most of these loops, I may have to relinquish that benefit if I took the graph switching approach.  Distributing the processing to maintain stability is crucial to my plan. Presently I am using two desktops and a laptop. My plan is to eventually replace the two desktops with a pair of Mac Minis mounted in a Sonnet rack mount for a more compact live rig. The marriage of all this software has to be very stable so there are no crashes on stage.  

Robert, have you tried the demo or at least investigated the specifications of Blue Cat Audio's PatchWork plugin?

It appears to be very relevant to what you've said you're trying to do. I've used it for years for a variety of odd tasks, including hosting a MIDI-controlled MultiFx rack. I've found it to be tremendously flexible and it's always done what I've wanted it to do.