MIRacle presets- 7th Row?

[Carl]

I'm trying out a few Miracle presets, the info on the presets say to use 'Mic-2 / 7th Row' but MIR has only a secondary mic 3rd row listed, no 7th.

Typo or is this missing in the MIR 24 version?

[Dietz]

Errrrrr .... you made me question my memory for a moment. :-D

In fact it depends on the chosen Venue were microphones have been positioned for capturing the IRs. In case of  Vienna Konzerthaus - Großer Saal it was Conductor, 7th row, 15th row, Gallery. In Mozartsaal we chose Conductor, 3rd row, Balustrade, Balcony. Neuer Saal comes with mic-setups at the Conductor's position, 7th and 15th row, "Gallery" (although there isn't a real gallery in that hall 8-] ...).

In The Sage Gateshead there is Hall One with Conductor, 4th row, Back of Hall, Gallery; Hall Two with Conductor, 5th row, FOH (i.e. the position of the mixing console), 2nd Gallery. ... and so on.

What I'm trying to say is - there's no rule, and the names I gave the presets which come with MIRacle are just a suggestion on how to use them. Most presets will fit other purposes, other Main Mic-positions and even other Venues, too, so don't stick to the letter too much. ;-)

HTH,

[Carl]

Got it.

I was using Mozartsaal with a Neuer Saal MIRacle preset. BTW MIRacle is quite nice & useful.

[Carl]

Here's a question I keep meaning to ask. In general & when using positions are you supposed to keep both main & secondary the same?
e.g.

main-conductor
secondary-3rd row

or

main-3rd row
secondary-3rd row

does it matter, pros/ cons, any phase or other issues when separating the two?
(I'm just now bouncing down each way, I'll listen & check stats too )

thanks

[Casiquire]

I would love to hear the response you get about this, but personally, I put the main mics very close, like in the Conductor position, and then the secondary mics farther back to capture the room.  This way I can play with how much detail comes through vs how much room comes through without having to increase the dry level or wet level.  It gives me a very natural sound.

[Dietz]

I concur with Casiquire: In 99% of all cases it makes little sense to use a Secondary Microphone setup from the same original position as the Main Mic (e.g.  "Conductor"). You could achieve a similar effect from the Main Mic only in that case - with more predictable and logical results.

The Secondary Mic is meant to be used for more de-correlated reflections and reverb for even better "envelopping" (something one could call the "aural sensation of space"). This can't happen when the Secondary Mic IRs come from the same position as the Main Mic's IRs, as their sonic signature will be very similar.

HTH,

[Dietz]

PS: ... from MIR Pro's Manual  (p. 19 ff)

 

@Another User said:

4.2. Secondary Microphone Setup

[...]

IMPORTANT:

Secondary Mic will deliver MIR Pro's wet signal only! (Otherwise the positioning of the dry signal on the stage would be wrong.)

[...]

MIR Pro's wet signal will be louder when adding the Secondary Microphone - use Global Dry / Wet Offset to compensate for unwanted changes. The same is true for the RoomTone, because it will be decoded according to the settings of both Microphones, too.

[...]

[Dietz]

PPS: The presets supplied by MIR Pro's new MIRx-Mode and the Venue Presets available from the VSL User Area show many examples of how I think the Secondary Microphone could be used. 😊

[Carl]

Thanks for the responses.

Frankly it's been so long since I changed any settings or positions in MIR that I forgot.

I tried both ways on several projects. I can hear the differences & always preferred the different positioning too. It was intereting to see the different peak levels & rms values betwwen the two.

+thanks for the manual & refs