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  4. Apple system-whats best?
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    The most fundamental issue with Logic 8 that is likely to affect VSL users is the arrange window. In 7 it presented a mini score where you could see all the notes, their position and to, some extent, their pitch. This incredibly useful tool has been removed.

    You can no longer colour objects in the environment to help with complex large arrangement mixes.

    You can no longer sample rate convert files in the sample edit window (where you could select parts of the file to work with)

    Every time you click on a region in the arrange the bottom part of your window is obscured with a window opening - you cannot defeat this behaviour.

    The compatibility of songs created in previous versions is somewhat buggy and incomplete in LP8 which anyone working on long running projects, or working on remixes, or having an archive will be concerned about.

    I'm a long (very) term Logic user, and one of it's biggest fans and appreciate some of the new features but these come with the disadvantage of moving the application more towards a Garage Band style whilst removing facilities that were fundamental to some high level pro workflows.

    Julian

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    @robert_1811 said:

    Brian, If you haven't yet put your money down, here's more input: just spent the last week configuring a 2.8Ghz 8-core, 16GB RAM (from Other World Computing) running logic 8, 3 full instances of VE (basically the whole of SE + Appassionatas), alongside a load of legacy stuff from First Edition running on EXS24, plus Stylus and Intakt. For the past ten years I have purchased a new mac every two years: 8600, G4, G4 Dual, G5 2.3Ghz dual and now this...and never during that period have I seen anything like the increase in performance offered by an 8-core over a G5 dual. Throwing indecent amounts of polyphony at it I haven't seen the CPUs go above 30%. Scrolling remains instantaneous within logic. The only sign of strain is that when I have a video playing from within logic there's a slight startup lag on video at moments. So the only reason I can see from here for upgrading beyond a base 2.8 would be to get an upgraded graphics card. Seriously, it's like having several computers...applause to Apple both for the machine and Logic 8. Cheers, Robert
    hi Robert havent bought the Mac because i've no way of knowing the benifits of the 3.2 GHZ over the 2.8GHZ-but your mail is encouraging-how much RAM can you access with the VI's? An exciting concept is becoming a reality to me with these latest Macs and with RAM from Other World computing-fianlly a single sysyem that can take on the 'farm' of daw's is here.I've heard that the 2.8 can run almost as much plugins as the 3.2 and you seem to find it powerful enough to run an incredible amount of full instances so it seem the 2.8 is the obvious choice.Do you think you'll see even better performance when 64 bit Leopard is supported and 64bit VI's for mac are available?
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    Double post
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    @Another User said:

    I'm a long (very) term Logic user, and one of it's biggest fans and appreciate some of the new features but these come with the disadvantage of moving the application more towards a Garage Band style whilst removing facilities that were fundamental to some high level pro workflows.
    We'll have to agree to disagree on that. Logic 8 takes a bit of readjustment, but I consider it better in every way for any level of user. I don't feel that it's been dumbed-down at all. In fact, I can't think of any other application that offers anywhere near the options for highly customizing the interface and optimizing the configuration for the way somebody wishes to work. I really wonder why things that are working for me in Logic 8 are not working for you. Is it possible that your current LP8 installation is corrupt? By any chance, are you using a non-OEM display card in your computer? Is it possible that your AutoLoad has acquired some problems? A flaky AutoLoad could also explain why older projects have difficulties. Also, is it possible that some of the key commands you used to use are acquired by a newer version of the Mac OS? Have you made any non-standard OS tweaks (e.g. disabled Quartz)? These are the only things I can think of for now.
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    Hi again Brian (By the way, anybody have a fix for no paragraphs showing when I type in Safari?). The data which convinced me to settle for a 2.8 is here: Scroll down to the second list (Mac Performance Feb2008) and compare your present computer to any of the 8-cores. As you'll see the difference between all of the 8-cores is small compared to the difference between them and the 4-cores. Obviously, there are many different ways to test speed, but you'll get the overall picture. Aside from that the decision of 2.8 v 3.0 v 3.2 depends on (i) the cash you can generate out of the machine and (ii) the emotional factor. What does it mean to you to have the very fastest mac on the planet? Perhaps you need to have that right now...not so much technically but in terms of what it means to you to have that - but just remember that in a few months time it will no longer be the fastest mac on the planet. Robert
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    Oops, looks like the link I put in the last post didn't make it...trying again. http://www.primatelabs.ca/blog/2008/02/
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    Thanks for the link.  Interestingly, it appears that my upgrade from a Quicksilver Dual 800 to a G5 Dual 2.7 in terms of processing power is roughly the same as my anticipated upgrade will be to a Mac Pro 3.2 (when the next models come out) -- roughly 4 times.  Can't wait to see what's in store in the next three years. 
  • J
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    Julian; The increase in speed would probably be more in the neighborhood of 8-10 times your dual G5! No way I would buy a 3.2ghz. Total waste of money in my opinion. Buy the 2.8 dual quad core. Put the rest of the money on the bank (or buy more Vienna Instruments) and wait for the next major Mac upgrade. Feel lucky.
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    @Jamzone said:

    Julian; The increase in speed would probably be more in the neighborhood of 8-10 times your dual G5! No way I would buy a 3.2ghz. Total waste of money in my opinion. Buy the 2.8 dual quad core.
    Purchases are not always made with 'needs' in mind. Sometimes we purchase an item simply because we 'want' it - therefore, it can never be a waste of money.
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    Well, that's your opinion. Seems like this fella is going for the most cost effective solution...
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    @Another User said:

    The compatibility of songs created in previous versions is somewhat buggy and incomplete in LP8 which anyone working on long running projects, or working on remixes, or having an archive will be concerned about.

    "I can't say that isn't the case for you, but I have not had any trouble in that department myself."

    Most of the comments about Logic 8 are subjective, but this point is actually factual: Logic 8 doesn't open some  older sequences that Logic 7 will. I forget how far back it chokes, but I do know that the v.5 sequences I tried simply won't open - I mean you even get a dialog telling you that the session is incompatible.

    Anyone who's been using Logic long enough to have sequences this old should not remove v.7.

  • S
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    Until some brave soul tests the differences between 2.8, 3.0 and 3.2 machines with the applications that forum participants use, it's hard to come to an objective understanding of what real-world performance differences might be.For a really in depth analysis of the new machines, I'd direct people to the test of the 2.8GHz machine at www.amug.org (you don't have to be a member to read the reviews). 

    As to Logic 7 vs. Logic 8: Logic 8 lacks the useful Audio Configuration window of Logic 7 and it consumes a bit more processing power - - important  perhaps to some G5 users.  Logic 8 is also slightly less legible - - at least to my tired eyes. On the other hand, it has many enhancements.
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    @Jamzone said:

    Well, that's your opinion. Seems like this fella is going for the most cost effective solution...
    Really? What kind of car do you drive? I drive a Mercedes CLK 240 convertible and I also have a Volkswagon Golf 2.8 4Motion.

    Do you think decisions like that are made on cost effectiveness?
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    hi Stevesong-thanks for the link to the apple pro test page-really helped-the increase is %14 in power on the Mac 3.2 model compared to the 2.8- so that now has to be weighed up against my budget-£6000-which includes memory,sibelius,logic hard drives and VI's.The general concensus is that in a Mac pro with ample RAM these are not real issues in audio and sample performance if RAID drives are used and the OS is all 64bit-this offers me 8-10 times the power i have at the moment which is awesome.
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    Get a couple of extra hard drives and a copy of Logic 7.2 also. Just to be safe.
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    @Jamzone said:

    Well, that's your opinion. Seems like this fella is going for the most cost effective solution...
    Really? What kind of car do you drive? I drive a Mercedes CLK 240 convertible and I also have a Volkswagon Golf 2.8 4Motion.

    Do you think decisions like that are made on cost effectiveness? I have a ford mondeo!!! 😊 but also i have graduated from the Royal College of music-won awards for composition,graduated from Oxford studying music-have a sister whos a concert pianist and have the ability to get from a to b at my own speed in my mondeo.Which is what im trying to do here with getting peoples advice on the Mac...if i need advice on a sports car and how to impress people with my wheels i'll let you know. cheers
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    If it's any consolation to you for the future - and your future transportation - I also attended The Royal College of Music - but sadly didn't win any awards. Come to think of it, you're first Mondeo Man that has a concert pianist sister, I've communicated with this year, I believe :))))


    Be careful with Logic 8 and the Mac Pro 8 core is my advice. There are still a legion of problems and this technology will be good one day when they sort it out. Therefore, by all means get Mac Pro 3.0 litre or 3.2 litre with extra fuel jets - but as I said - get an extra hard drive or two - stick Logic 7.2.3 and Tiger 10.4.11 on it just to be on the safe side. It's all bollocks at the end of the day - it's all about making music on a system that works and is tested - and 7.2 and Tiger works pretty well.

    Now if you'll excuse me - I need to oversee the cleaning of my cars! :))
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    Hi Brian, Watch out for that new CO2 tax on your Mondeo! Hope your system comes together smoothly and provides hours of compositional pleasure. Julian
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    Yes indeed - and hours of pleasurable driving too - perhaps with his sister!
  • J
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    In this case, yes, I don't think he wants to spend money on something that he doesn't need. You could buy Appassionata full library and Special Edition Standard and still have change... When it comes to cars, that's a different matter. I drive a BMW 540i. Worth every gallon... :)