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  3. How to deal with the tempo that is coming out of my soul

  • How to deal with the tempo that is coming out of my soul

    S
    S

    Hi,

    I'm sitting in my little studio and try to improvise a little piece into my sequencer and wonder how you're dealing with the, well, natural tempo changes. I'm working with C4 and know there's the tempo track and some other little helpers. My question: Is there a way C4 (or any other Sequencer - maybe it's time to change it) can create the tempo track based on my free played midi performance? In that performance all the changes are like they should but I also want to have the notes on the right positions in the grid - not fully quantized but around the right positions, of course :-) I found that time warp util in C4 where I can move the beginning of every single bar to the right note and regarding to this C4 creates the events into the tempo track but I hope there's a more faster way to do it. Maybe automatically...?? Is there something??

    Thanks for helping on.

    My best Stephan
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    I do not see any reasons to add a tempolist after the fact you recorded the music with varying tempi, I mean recorded is recorded and thats it.
  • S
    S

    At the moment I just have the piano line and I want to build up orchestral stuff on it. Of course I could do this free as well but if I want to change something on the tempo later it seems a bit more complicated then just click here and there in the tempo track. So it would be great if I could control it over that tempo track. Besides everything is a bit more cleaned up then...not so much tiny pauses here and there in the score.

    I'm coming from electronic dance music and I'm used to have a cleaned up piano roll and score...well, there I don't need a score, to be honest I don't even need notes there :-D

    My best

    Stephan

    Btw: Thanks for that nice orchestral enviroment guide. It was from you, wasn't it. 
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    There are several ways to record tempo changes in real time or to createa tempolist to fit the music into a grid after the fact of playing the music into a software.

    Make a Tempo Track in advance:

    Tempo changes are controlled by tempo events, which are stored in a special tempo track. This track is not visible in the Arrange window. The tempo track applies to the whole song. The tempo track also determines the relationship between incoming time code, and the current song position.

    Recording Tempo Changes during record by hitting ¼ notes on a pedal which is routed to tempo recording. The tempo is constantly adjusted to the time interval between two strokes

    Activate the Allow Tempo Change Recording. All tempo alterations which you make during recording will now be recorded as tempo events on the tempo track. You can then edit them in one of the tempo editors.

    Adjusting the Tempo to Fit Regions

    This I use when I have pre-recorded material. I cut the material into measures and apply "Adjust Tempo by Tempo and Locators"
  • S
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    Hi Angelo,

    thanks for the hint for the "tempo change recording". I don't know if C4 has that but will search for it. Otherwise I try to tap it in with a pedal.

    Cheers

    Stephan
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    @stephanhinz said:

    Hi,

    I'm sitting in my little studio and try to improvise a little piece into my sequencer and wonder how you're dealing with the, well, natural tempo changes. I'm working with C4 and know there's the tempo track and some other little helpers. My question: Is there a way C4 (or any other Sequencer - maybe it's time to change it) can create the tempo track based on my free played midi performance? In that performance all the changes are like they should but I also want to have the notes on the right positions in the grid - not fully quantized but around the right positions, of course 😊 I found that time warp util in C4 where I can move the beginning of every single bar to the right note and regarding to this C4 creates the events into the tempo track but I hope there's a more faster way to do it. Maybe automatically...?? Is there something??

    Thanks for helping on.

    My best Stephan

    When you are more experienced you can use Warp almost in real time. However, there is also merge from tap tempo, which is done in real time. All of this is very easy in Cubase, and one of the best features of the DAW. This is much more difficult in all other sequencers apart from DP, where it is almost as easy as Cubase.

    DG
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    I am not familiar with Cubase - but as mentioned above DP can manage this kind of thing too. For me tempo manipulation is as important as note pitch manipulation!

    In DP you can record freetime (midi or audio or both) with no reference to any click and then use a feature 'record beats' which plays back the performance while you tap a midi condroller (finger pad/ piano key etc) in time with it. DP will realign the tempo grid to match your 'conducting'. End result is that the performance remains unchanged and tempo is mapped to it.

    Any areas that need tightening up can be done with 'adjust beats' where you can literally drag the beat/ bar lines around to line up with (for instance) the start of midi notes or transients of audio (snapping is an option too). Again performance is unaffected, you're just manipulating the tempo map. (Of course DP can do it the other way round and align performance to tempo as well)

    A favourite method for me is to record a 'performance orientated track' (piano, or rhythm style guitar - both instruments that express rythmic / dynamic changes well) concentrating ONLY on a good performance in terms of tempo, drive, wild abandoned expression etc! (and not worrying about missed notes or fudged chords in the slightest).... then I will map the tempo and meter to this performance track (as already descibed above) .... then I will start actually laying down tracks to the (now very musical) click track. So the original 'performance track' is never intended to be used, the piece may not even use piano or guitar, it is just used to create the click.

    This is how I get the 'tempo that is coming out of my soul' into a sequencer! :)
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    That method of operation sound very good. Will give that a try...

    Thank you all!

    My best

    Stephan 
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    mmm... this does sound like a nice way of managing tempo. In fact, it's something I've always kind of dreamed of having in Logic. Often times, I work with no sense of tempo at all, simply following the raw musical gestures. Getting this sort of performance/improv onto a grid is almost impossible in traditional sequencers, and I usually have to just "re-interpret" it - which basically means working out the pulse, and doing it all over again... I may have to give DP another try.

    J.
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    I use a program called MIDI Workshop (part of SAWStudio) that utilizes a similar feature as DP. It's very fast and simple. Here's a quote from the 'features' page of their website:

    A unique measure mapping feature allows freeform performances to be easily and instantly mapped to a measure grid, which automatically calculates tempo variations, and allows for perfect Conductor/Click Track creation. The data may then be set or averaged into a perfectly smooth performance, allowing easy orchestration or quantizing of added data in perfect time.    

    http://www.sawstudio.com/products_midi_workshop.htm

    I've used this program to sequence even the most complex and large orchestral pieces. You can dowload a free demo with only a few limitations and check it out for yourself.

    Good Luck
  • N
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    Logic has had that exact feature (recording a new tempo track by playing in quarter notes) for years. Even Vision had it - this is nothing new.

    But the way I like to do it is to copy notes that fall on the beat and paste them into a new track to use as the guide track for the tempo, if necessary adding the missing notes. That's more accurate than tapping and it makes it easier to play and edit other parts later.
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    Nick, this is just sad... I've been using Logic, on and off, for ages, and I never knew about that! I suppose that's what that huge book is for... something about "Logic Pro User Manual", or something... not sure. I'll take a look at it. ;-)

    J.
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    @Another User said:

    But the way I like to do it is to copy notes that fall on the beat and paste them into a new track to use as the guide track for the tempo, if necessary adding the missing notes. That's more accurate than tapping and it makes it easier to play and edit other parts later.

    I'll have to try that one of these days. The concept doesn't work in my head – it seems that as soon as you adjust the tempo to hit a MIDI event (in your copied track) that event will move somewhere else because the tempo is now different. It seems that you would have to record it as an audio track to keep the tempo constant. Or does Logic have a feature to look at the events in a track as quarter notes and turn that into the new tempo track?  
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    That's right. The way the feature works - in DP, Logic, or in RIP Vision - is that you record quarter notes into a track that's then used to reclock the session. Obviously the sequencer doesn't care whether you recorded the quarter notes in real time while listening to the music or copy/pasted them in (if necessary setting them all to the same pitch).
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    By the way, other programs probably have the same feature too - those are just the ones I'm familiar with.