2nd solo violin ?

[SyQuEsT]

Hello,

I really like the viola, cello and doublebass but I'm not sure about the violin (maybe the vibrato). I like to use it on some productions but it doesn't work all the time.

I'm not sure but the recording of the solo violin isn't the same.

It's the only thing I could ask about strings. I think a "good" solo violin with the appassionata would sound very very well.

If we could control the vibrato (non vibrato - vib - strong vib) via modwheel (or any CC), I could improve the general sound.

My 2 cents ...
Thanks! [[;)]]

[JWL]

@SyQuEsT said:

If we could control the vibrato (non vibrato - vib - strong vib) via modwheel (or any CC), I could improve the general sound.

My 2 cents ...
Thanks! [[;)]]

Isn't this already possible with vel x-fade?

[SyQuEsT]

I don't think : you can play non vibrato on a forte velocity

[stevesong]

You can crossfade between the vibrato and non vibrato samples using the cell X-fade. However, I don't find this a fully satisfactory solution - - you have to do it very quickly or you briefly hear two violins in the middle of the cross fade. In addition, the progressive vibrato moves between non-vibrato and vibrato over a set time period so that it works effectively at some tempos but in others.

What is really needed is some kind of morphing technology that would allow interpolation of (computer generated) transitional states between actual samples - - with the time period under the control of the user. This seems to be the approach used by the Garritan solo violin. However, from the demos of that library available on the Garritan site (I have not heard the Garritan solo violin library other than listening to the online demos) I am not particlarly impressed with the quality of the samples themselves.

One thing that seems to help the VI solo strings is to set key velocity as a controller for the master filter setting in the Perform window and create a very non-linear curve for its operation (straight up the left side of the window and then a very gradual curve over a small range. This increases the amount of timbral change with small velocity differences. If you are using Logic, you can also use a velocity limiter in conjunction with this to prevent very low velocities from causing unrealistic sounds. Similarly, using the same kind of very non-linear curve, you can make key velocity the source for Exprssion (CC11) and this may give you a more nuanced dynamic range. Using these settings simultaneously sometimes helps avoid the sense of abrupt change when moving from one sampled dynamic level to another.

[Mahlon]

@stevesong said:

This seems to be the approach used by the Garritan solo violin. However, from the demos of that library available on the Garritan site (I have not heard the Garritan solo violin library other than listening to the online demos) I am not particlarly impressed with the quality of the samples themselves.

Have a listen to the version 2.0 violin which is posted at NorthernSounds. Don't know if it's on Garritan's site or not. This seems to have fixed the nasal, stringent sound in the first version. Really, pretty impressive demo.

http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47968

Mahlon

[DG]

@stevesong said:

This seems to be the approach used by the Garritan solo violin. However, from the demos of that library available on the Garritan site (I have not heard the Garritan solo violin library other than listening to the online demos) I am not particlarly impressed with the quality of the samples themselves.

Have a listen to the version 2.0 violin which is posted at NorthernSounds. Don't know if it's on Garritan's site or not. This seems to have fixed the nasal, stringent sound in the first version. Really, pretty impressive demo.

http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/showthread.php?t=47968

Mahlon
God awful racket.........

DG

[hermitage59]

@Another User said:

God awful racket.........

DG

lol. I take it you enjoyed the rendition, Daryl.

[[:|]]

[DG]

@Another User said:

God awful racket.........

DG

lol. I take it you enjoyed the rendition, Daryl.

[[:|]]I'm trying very hard not to let my fingers do the walking on this one.

DG

[PaulR]

@DG said:

God awful racket.........DG

Is there a cello too? I heard a Bach thing on a cello earlier this evening and was feeling generous.

Generosity! That was my first mistake! (Eli Wallach)

I heard this violin too, and it's not too bad apart from the fact that there doesn't seem to be enough 'behind' the sound if you understand any of that. For a sample/modeling sound it's not too bad.

I never hear enough tonal variety - this the problem with solo strings in general. But it's samples at the end of the day. A lot of modeling needs to be incorporated I suspect. Raw samples may never really cut it.

[DG]

@DG said:

God awful racket.........DG

Is there a cello too? I heard a Bach thing on a cello earlier this evening and was feeling generous.

Very; I was quite overcome with your reserve [:D]

DG

[PaulR]

@DG said:

God awful racket.........DG

Is there a cello too? I heard a Bach thing on a cello earlier this evening and was feeling generous.

Very; I was quite overcome with your reserve [:D]

DG

Yeah - but you couldn't fail to notice I was totally ignored. This what you get when you try to be subtle - and kind.

[:D]

[Sangit]

they say cello, viola and bass will be ready at the end of the year..

[DG]

@Sangit said:

they say cello, viola and bass will be ready at the end of the year..

Ready for what? Burning?

DG

[SyQuEsT]

The future will arrive in a future ! [[;)]]

So, we have to wait ... but I really like the sound of the VSL ... maybe some improvement with the solo wiolin could be fine ... Anyway, we'll see in an update.

[[[;)]]]

[esperlad]

I would like to see an actual second violin.

[mathis]

@Sangit said:

they say cello, viola and bass will be ready at the end of the year..

Ready for what? Burning?

DG

Hehe, I understand you. My immediate reactions to these Garritans demos was very similar. But since I changed my workflow from cut&paste sample editing to performing samples I got very curious. One has to realize that the guys doing these demos aren't really that musical (man, am I arrogant...) and these instruments reflect that. The vibrato is totally controllable and you really have to know how to use it, like a violin player. These instruments don't make things easier for the composer/performer, in fact it's the other way round. They seem to be really difficult to play (well!) which is maybe not the nicest thing Garritan could do to his main customer base, after he introduced GPO. These Garritan Solo Strings in the hand of VSL users would sound very different, I'm convinced.

One still can argue about the basic tone of these instruments. But they're all realtime playable in all dynamic shades and vibrato facettes. I really like that approach.

[DG]

@Sangit said:

they say cello, viola and bass will be ready at the end of the year..

Ready for what? Burning?

DG

Hehe, I understand you. My immediate reactions to these Garritans demos was very similar. But since I changed my workflow from cut&paste sample editing to performing samples I got very curious. One has to realize that the guys doing these demos aren't really that musical (man, am I arrogant...) and these instruments reflect that. The vibrato is totally controllable and you really have to know how to use it, like a violin player. These instruments don't make things easier for the composer/performer, in fact it's the other way round. They seem to be really difficult to play (well!) which is maybe not the nicest thing Garritan could do to his main customer base, after he introduced GPO. These Garritan Solo Strings in the hand of VSL users would sound very different, I'm convinced.

One still can argue about the basic tone of these instruments. But they're all realtime playable in all dynamic shades and vibrato facettes. I really like that approach.
I agree with you. The real value in theses instruments is the fact that they can be played in real time and I have always said that this is a huge deal. What I take issue with is the title of the thread;

"Could This Possibly Be One of the Best Sampled Solo Violin Demos Ever?" The answer is a resounding "Not on your life".

However, had the title been "Could This Possibly Be One of the Best Sampled Solo Violin Demos of a derivative, unimaginative, crass piece of Muzak, all played in real time, Ever?", then I might have been tempted to agree.

I must also admit that I was slightly irked by the fact that a link to this product was posted on a rival company's forum; the height of bad manners IMO.

DG

[mathis]

[:D]

@DG said:

I must also admit that I was slightly irked by the fact that a link to this product was posted on a rival company's forum; the height of bad manners IMO.

DG

Where was that?

[cm]

fifth post in this thread ... regarding the fact it is linked here - usually you might have read some disgruntled comment from me or another moderator, but espexcially taking into account gary's dedication to sampling, i'd consider it as *just informational*.
as you know there has been actually a cooperation between garritan and VSL (cross-upgrade from GPO to opus) and we don't want to start counting referrers from other forums to ours and vice versa now ...
christian

[DG]

@DG said:

I must also admit that I was slightly irked by the fact that a link to this product was posted on a rival company's forum; the height of bad manners IMO.

DG

Where was that?
Sorry, I should have been more accurate. It was a link to a thread started by the product developer telling us how good it was. I just don't think that when we are guests of VSL we should be promoting other company's products in the VSL forum, but maybe I'm just old fashioned.

Or maybe I'm just old [[:|]]

DG