Thank 

    you

       Dietz!

Sean,

Since the East West stuff is so much cheaper, would you advocate buying their HW brass and strings and then VSL solo stuff?

dsilvercoin

 Hi Sean,

 Hope you won't expect Dietz to answer to this question :)), just kidding maybe he will..

 Best

@ dsilvercoin: You're welcome!

BTW - thanks in advance for keeping the discussion on 3rd-party products at an acceptable level ... ;-)

@dsilvercoin said:

Since the East West stuff is so much cheaper, would you advocate buying their HW brass and strings and then VSL solo stuff?

This can be a difficult question to address... but as biased as I'll sound for a moment, my conclusion is still very open ended (sorry)... BUT I think it may help you come to a conclusion you will be happy with.

If flexibility is paramount across the spectrum, then no. I'd say VSL. If you prefer the HS sound and intend to have that sound in most or all of your work, then you'd probably be safe with that and VSL solo strings. My personal choice is to wait on any major string expansions until VSL releases some kind of Dimension strings, etc. But that's because I already have an adequate enough and diverse base for the meantime. But if you desire to purchase a library now (as I'm assuming you do)... AND you don't hear a big difference in the resulting sound... then personally the only other consideration I can see would be cost vs ease of use. I will elaborate on that. I could also see someone arguing 'stay within one library for ease of management, etc' but honestly that doesn't appeal to me very much. I care about sound realism more than anything else. After that I care about ease, but not at the expense of sound. That's always been my main approach in decision making.

Cost vs Ease -

I'm not sure how familiar you are or aren't with EW's and VSL's setups. This may sound a bit anti-EW cause I'm starting out with a 'plus' for VSL but keep in mind, I'm not going to ignore that it is cheaper. I'm just giving you a weight on the other side of the balance to help make the decision more informed (and sorry, probably harder as you said...lol) EW has promised a new sample player for years and have talked about the development for a long time. With no new developments there, you would be using their current software. This means midi channel per articulation. Some people have found some creative ways to help ease that pain... but it is still a pain to work with. I don't want to have a staccato track for each instrument, and a sustain, and a... I want a cello line, and I want to write for that like I would manuscript. I prefer this. VSL, in even the free Vienna Instruments, is well beyond the capabilities of EW or Kontakt or any other offering. VI Pro only expands the control of how you build your template. I'm not even talking about Humanize, auto-divisi, tuning options, and all the other great features lacking in the alternatives. I'm simply talking the basics of your template at this point (keyswitching options, routing, etc). VSL software makes life very easy with how flexible it allows your workflow to be. Even many EW users would agree with this point.

By all means, if your budget is limited then the consideration of cost may be just as important. Therefore, I'm not trying to sway you away from EW and that is why I'm mentioning this ultimate concluding point- If you don't hear a big difference in sound... what else is there between them? To me, the only things that stand out are cost vs ease of use.

I hope I haven't made that too hard for you, lol. But I think that this is an accurate answer enough to help you be informed enough in your decisions.

-Sean

(Although, I'd advocate HS with VSL brass before HS and HB... and yeah, I'll admit some bias on that one. I just like how VSL brass sounds, lol)

Oh, and speaking of brass. When listening to HB vs VSL... I'd recommend listening to the Fanfare trumpet's Star Wars demo's for VSL. I'm not trying to discredit EW... It would still be important to listen to both sides, of course. I only intend to provide what I'd recommend for listening to on this site as to me, those specific demos are very convincing.

-Sean

 dsilvercoin,

I hope you got as much info as you wanted. "iscorefilm" is an info machine that spits out data haha. If your field was small ensembles, then VSL is the way to go. Nothing can match in this area as of today. Public opinion counts big and streaming thru VSL blogs, everyone seem very happy... now that's a big plus to lean towards VSL. As much as I praised Hollywood Strings and Hollywood Brass, and Spitfire... I don't see a REGULAR user making demos in their products. On the VSL site, most demos contain the wave file and also the MIDI file to download if you wanted to see how it was done. VSL has to admit that some of the demos displayed are HORRIBLE! but they do it anyways, they show you both sides of the story

w21994,

I actually think SOME of the demo's are great (like the Starwars ones and the previous solo string ones I referenced)... but in general, I agree. Much of the VSL demo's aren't all that amazing. I understand why to a degree from what I assume is VSL's perspective, but I would still agree that they could and should put some better demo's on here! (Or at least remove some of the less appealing ones... less of great is better than many of wide ranging quality, imo)

And yes, I spit it out alright- and proud of it! With those I know personally, I'm often compared to "Johnny 5" from Short Circuit "Input! Input!" as I could go on for hours about something I find interesting or useful. I get this looming feeling that someday the VSL team will reach their limit with me and say, "Seriously... he's still jabbering on and on? Let's just delete his account and get rid of him!" lol

-Sean

Thank you all for all the advice. It is so greatly appreciated. I will get VSL and add on other libraries as needed. The question I have to figure ou tnow is which package(s) to get. 

Perhaps it is best to start this question in a new/ mor especific thread, but if anyone wants to chime in here I'd be most appreciatove. Again, a VSL rep said that they thought that the Special Edition would not be enough of a bump up from what I've got (Miroslav, Garittan 1st edition, QL brass 1st edition).  He recommended I look at the cube which is an appealing, though expensive possibility.

However, perhaps there is a better fit of instruments (solo and sections) that one could put together on their own and then add as need (jobs) requires. I know solo instruments would be a necessity as would some of orchestral sections (there are just so many VSL offerings that it's hard to know which one is best).

Thanks all![:)]

 iscorefilm,

if you think you can compare the VSL "Star Wars" theme demo to any of the EW Hollywood Series demo, you are high on crack. I would question your musicianship. Any musician with decent listening capabilities will tell you that the demos on EW sound more "real"

w21994,

I mixed Jay Bacal's version of "Star Wars Theme". We A/B-ed Willams' original and the virtual version constantly throughout the whole production, and from a certain point onwards the sound was so close that things were starting to get confusing. Maybe the EW demos sound more real than real.

I can live with the fact that you obviously dispute _my_ hearing capabilities; OTOH, I think it's quite offensive to tell the same thing to literally thousands of musicians on this board who don't share your opinion.

But I have a real problem with the fact that you're starting fellow forum members calling names with your 19th message already, only because you quite clearly have a strong bias towards a 3rd-party product.

I'd say this thread has clearly outlived its raison d'être now. We will close it before things get out of hand.

Sincerely,

Since I read pretty interested this thread again and again, I personally wondered aboaut that licenseterm-problem. That's why I asked the Spitfire-Audio Support of the exact meaning of this sentence in their License Terms:

The Libraries/Samples...."are licensed to you only for use as part of a musical performance, live or recorded. You may not use these sounds in commercial and non commercial uses except where you have combined them with other sounds within musical compositions."

This is the Answer I've got, which clearly limit this restriction only on attemps to make open or comercial intended copies of the the samplecontent: 

"What that line from our EULA basically means that if you were to make a composition that was just you going through all the notes of our libraries so that someone could potentially download and make a makeshift version of our library,
then that would break our EULA.

However if you are making a composition that only uses our libraries or just one of our libraries, then that would be fine."

To me at least in respects about concerns on license-restrictions this makes it more realistic to think about some Library additions and enhancments from Spitfire-samples while I still do have some doubts if the variety of available articulations are as easily managable and being kept available as we are used it from the VI. Howwever perhaps I'll give them a try sooner or later if they will offer any interesting discount or the british pound is low enough,

This old thread has been closed for a good reason back then, but it seems as something has inadvertently changed its status to "active", most likely during the migration to the new forum engine. I hope you understand that we will close it again, especially as there is no VSL-related discussion going on.