I mean that it's an oxymoron to say "the best out-of-the-box library" about a complete dry library. It's not a critique against VI dry libraries, it's just a fact that you have to add MIR (or another reverb) and you have to shape your sound from scratch. That's amazing actually! But it's the opposite of "out-of-the-box".
And if you ask me, I'm not interested at all in the Synchronized series, because in my humble opinion it mixes together the worst of the two worlds: with the Synchronized series you miss the freedom of VI-libraries, so as the the naturalness of a "real-wet recorded" library (MIR it's great, but to simulate virtual mics it's not the same that recording the real thing, for many reasons).
Not to mention (and this one is a VSL choice, not a technical reason) the synchronized series miss many articulations of the original VI-counterpart (and this one looks like a sad trend in the Synchron Series).
This is just me. There are plenty of new and old users that may find this new series useful.
No wishes anyway :) I'm quite stuffed with samples, so it's more and more difficult to convince me to buy new stuff; at the same time it looks like all companies release more and more similar products. Two skew lines at the moment :)
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the synchronized series miss many articulations of the original VI-counterpart (and this one looks like a sad trend in the Synchron Series).You know, that:
- Many Articulations provided as tons seperate Articulations in the VI-Series are already integrated in the main patches, like "repetetitions" or "Harsh" etc.
- Synchron Strings "I" is just a Volume "I" to get the full set, we still have to be patient (good things need their time)
- You can already now achieve many charateristics of VI-patchtypes currently not part of the Synchron Strings I with use of the Manipulating-Options of the Synchron player
- Filter for Sordini - as the only way many competitors are providing Sordini,
- different Attack values for smoother or more aggresive character,
- Editing Velocity-Xfade+ Expression via CC to get the natural tone development of longer stringnotes
As I said I do respect your Opinion and do not intend to convince you to anything, but those are the aspects, which seem to me a bit different, from how you described it as I understood it.
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I understand the Synchronized Libraries as exception and I say Chamber and Appassionata will be the only transfer to the Sy Player FOR STRINGS.Regarding to Paul's new introduction video my assumption was correct.
Means: No transfer to SY for EVERY VI-product (... and this is good)! It is better to keep the VI-Series separated with a dedicated Player that will be modernized/improved one day. (Time-Stretching, MirX-Mode and Humanizing make no sense for the SY-Series anyway ...)Cheers.
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I understand the Synchronized Libraries as exception and I say Chamber and Appassionata will be the only transfer to the Sy Player FOR STRINGS.Regarding to Paul's new introduction video my assumption was correct.
Means: No transfer to SY for EVERY VI-product (... and this is good)! It is better to keep the VI-Series separated with a dedicated Player that will be modernized one day.Cheers.
OK "transfer to SY for EVERY VI-product" is presumably already therefore not necessary, because new Synmchron-Libraries will in any case be build originally for Synchron-Player and therefore fit much better, than anything "synchronized".
While I still believe the Dimension Strings would benefit very much from being transfered (and the player perhaps to if we think about the humanizating features introduced with dimension strings.)
However the Dimension Strings are still a very powerful and most appreciated Libraries, which in their complex structure will scarcly be replaced so fast by any Synchron Library..
If ever they would teach any Editing-Software to edit their existing samples in kind of any "batch rendering" as diligent, as their engineers currently do, this will boost up the output tremenmdously and a Synchronized Dimension-String Library will be much more realistic to get.
(Oh shit again one of my impudent futuristic suggestions for the VSL-Developpers, which will not be realised earlier than in approximatly five years😛)
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If ever they would teach any Editing-Software to edit their existing samples in kind of any "batch rendering" as diligent, as their engineers currently do, this will boost up the output tremenmdously and a Synchronized Dimension-String Library will be much more realistic to get.
That is what I mean with improvements. But as I wrote above (edited) some features like MIR-X-Modi (for all kind of Roompacks etc.) do not fit in the SY-Player. That's why I think a dedicated solution - similar to the SY-GUI is better. And ... think of the "Transposition Trick-Button" ... 😄 ... biggest wish of all ... :D💡😎🍺
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The Synchron-Player is by far much more individual configurable than the VI ever could be. As far as I can see you are of course always able to work with it in nearly every aspect as you did with VI before.
Where are "simulate virtual mics"???? You never could or even was supposed to do that in Mir. The Synchronized Libraries also doesn't provide anyother than the real recorded Microphoneposition and the Microphonepositions in the Synchron Series-are of course not at all "virtual" in any way. So perhaps I did'nt understood you but I can not see any "virtual mics" at all.
First, thank you very much for answering politely 😊
You got my points wrong because I express myself poorely, my fault!
When I said that you lose the freedom of VI series (when using the Synchronized series) it's because you're not able anymore to change room, position on the stage, and many other factor. And at the moment you don't have special VI Pro feature like humanize and stretching.
And about MIR, I'm pretty sure I'm right instead 😊 MIR makes ambisonics computing simulating the propagation of the sound of instruments and "virtual microphones" patterns that catch the sound. You don't see that, because you get a"stereo decoding" as result. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong.
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To try explaining myself better: I think you never have a simple convolution with the "real recorded responses" in MIR PRO, neither in MIRx or with the Syncronized Series. It's always new IRs calculated taking into account several factors; in the case of MIRx and Synchronized seris VSL already made that choices computing for you, so that your system is "simpling" doing a convolution with a pair of responses, where you can just set the ratio of the convolution.
But even if you do a 100% convolution with a simple IRs recorded in an hall, it's not the same result of a real recording (as for the syncron series and for the majority of libraries out there) ; I think every users here agreed that the 3D definition of the Syncron Series is a "step-forward. It is so obvious, but it comes with a price: the only way you have to change the stereo imaging perception is to change the balance of various mics positions.
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And about MIR, I'm pretty sure I'm right instead 😊 MIR makes ambisonics computing simulating the propagation of the sound of instruments and "virtual microphones" patterns that catch the sound. You don't see that, because you get a"stereo decoding" as result. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong.
As far as I understood it, MIR does not rely in any way on different (virtual) Microphone positions, but calculate the acoustic reflections of a "Source" depending to its position in the room nevertheless "recorded" by only one Stereomicrophone. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong.
If I remeber right Dietz has already experimented (inhouse only) with a Multimicrophone Version of Mir, which gave several complex possible simulation problems to solve that he rejected to develop anything like that for the user. However what we currently are able to mix in MIR is nothing more than the Dry + wet ratio.
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"I think every users here agreed that the 3D definition of the Syncron Series is a "step-forward." - fabioa
What does that mean?
You are saying it is better than MIR?
I'm stating the obvious 😊 : a well-done real recording will always be more natural than dry samples plus digital/convolution reverbs.
That doesn't mean that difference is huge, and as we know wet samples comes with some downsides.
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The Synchron-Player is by far much more individual configurable than the VI ever could be. As far as I can see you are of course always able to work with it in nearly every aspect as you did with VI before.
Where are "simulate virtual mics"???? You never could or even was supposed to do that in Mir. The Synchronized Libraries also doesn't provide anyother than the real recorded Microphoneposition and the Microphonepositions in the Synchron Series-are of course not at all "virtual" in any way. So perhaps I did'nt understood you but I can not see any "virtual mics" at all.
First, thank you very much for answering politely 😊
You got my points wrong because I express myself poorely, my fault!
When I said that you lose the freedom of VI series (when using the Synchronized series) it's because you're not able anymore to change room, position on the stage, and many other factor. And at the moment you don't have special VI Pro feature like humanize and stretching.
And about MIR, I'm pretty sure I'm right instead 😊 MIR makes ambisonics computing simulating the propagation of the sound of instruments and "virtual microphones" patterns that catch the sound. You don't see that, because you get a"stereo decoding" as result. I hope someone will correct me if I'm wrong.Well... Fabio to be honest I don't think his answer was polite at all, the opposite was enphatic (as usual) and dictated by ignorance of basic sound engineering! Obviously you are right and anybody with a minimal understanding of digital audio and wording knows.
About VI vs. Syn. again the statement is enphatic and wrong: it's obvious that VI has more features than Synchron: disregarding the sequencing features, anyway at least the brilliant humanization functions are missing in Synchron.
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The Synchron-Player is by far much more individual configurable than the VI ever could be.
Just in order to comply with my natural obligation to oppose blatant anti-intellectualism:
This is nonsense.
Carry on!
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Well... Fabio to be honest I don't think his answer was polite at all, the opposite was enphatic (as usual) and dictated by ignorance of basic sound engineering! Obviously you are right and anybody with a minimal understanding of digital audio and wording knows.
About VI vs. Syn. again the statement is enphatic and wrong: it's obvious that VI has more features than Synchron: disregarding the sequencing features, anyway at least the brilliant humanization functions are missing in Synchron.
Puh.... Fatis as we know him.... 👎
unfortunately many unpolite personal debasing words ("dictated by ignorance of basic sound engineering") and, very little contribution to the Subject of the thread:
- Yes I did'nt mentioned the "Sequencer", since nearly nobody uses VI or Synchron without a real fully featured DAW-Sequencer like Cubase etc.
- the rest is wrong (of course I have discussed the "humanization" features)
- or without any concrete substance (what ever is "enpathic" I never heard and could not find this word at all 😕 I even have no Idea what sens it would have, or what contribution to the Subject of this thread it would be if you meant "emphatic" instead)
I hope we will and can better keep and continue the discussion as polite as Fabio has done.
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The Synchron-Player is by far much more individual configurable than the VI ever could be.
Just in order to comply with my natural obligation to oppose blatant anti-intellectualism:
This is nonsense.
Carry on!
That is so true - it is absolute nonsense. With VI you have total control of all MIDI parameters down to the patch level in a powerful interface that is simple and direct and completely reconfigurable. It can be as simple as one articulation, or as complex as hundreds - whatever the player wishes.
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With VI you have total control of all MIDI parameters down to the patch level in a powerful interface that is simple and direct and completely reconfigurable. It can be as simple as one articulation, or as complex as hundreds - whatever the player wishes.As far as I can see in the Synchron Player you likewise do have "total control of all MIDI parameters down to the patch level in a powerful interface that is simple and direct and completely reconfigurable. It can be as simple as one articulation, or as complex as hundreds - whatever the player wishes"
- Just take a look on the Midi CC's asigned to each single Parameter and the Dropdown menu to configure that controle as you like.
- You can easily "edit" the individual level and envelope and further details of each patch, or treeposition with all its dependend Subtree items in the "Edit" section.
There is as far as I know nothing missing what we have had in VI. Correct me if I am wrong. But this aspect does not seem to make any difference in customizability between VI and Syn-Player.
But:
- In Vi you are not able to controle the Level of any Mixer-Slot with any individual Midi-CC in Synchron Player each Value of a Mixerslot could be asigned to its own Cotrole option (Midi CC etc.)
- Do you remember the tremerdous complex VE-Templates the VSL-Guys provided for Synchron-Samples while the Synchron Player was not available. It does not seem to me that the necessity of such Templates would be any kind of advantage.
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Well... Fabio to be honest I don't think his answer was polite at all, the opposite was enphatic (as usual) and dictated by ignorance of basic sound engineering! Obviously you are right and anybody with a minimal understanding of digital audio and wording knows. About VI vs. Syn. again the statement is enphatic and wrong: it's obvious that VI has more features than Synchron: disregarding the sequencing features, anyway at least the brilliant humanization functions are missing in Synchron.
Puh.... Fatis as we know him.... unfortunately many unpolite personal debasing words ("[i]dictated by ignorance of basic sound engineering[/i]") and, very little contribution to the Subject of the thread: [list]- [i]Yes I did'nt mentioned the "Sequencer", since nearly nobody uses VI or Synchron without a real fully featured DAW-Sequencer like Cubase etc. [/i]
- [i]the rest is wrong (of course I have discussed the "humanization" features) [/i]
- [i]or without any concrete substance (what ever is "e[b]n[/b]pathic" I never heard and could not find this word at all 😕 I even have no Idea what sens it would have, or what contribution to the Subject of this thread it would be if you meant "e[b]m[/b]phatic" instead)
[/list] I hope we will and can better keep and continue the discussion as polite as Fabio has done. Emphatic because of the “ ???” Just to underline your ignorant retoric question, because you don’t know what simulated virtual mic was meaning, and that it’s exactly what you have in MIR and what you have in synchronized libraries, as Fabio later correctly explained to you. The day you will stop teaching about things other know better than you, will always be too late. But to quote you, that’s YOU the way we know YOU 😂😂😂
[/i]
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If I am right the "term" "virtual Mic" is not used in any way by VSL to describe any aspect of their products. If I am wrong just show me where VSL uses it. That is the reason why I am asking what you exactly mean when you use it. Unfortunatly you havent yet answered this simple question at all, but prefered obviously to write strange posting occupied with the number of Questionmarks someone uses.
However if this is all, what you are able to contribute.... your problem.
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If I am right the "term" "virtual Mic" is not used in any way by VSL to describe any aspect of their products. If I am wrong just show me where VSL uses it. That is the reason why I am asking what you exactly mean when you use it. Unfortunatly you havent yet answered this simple question at all, but prefered obviously to write strange posting occupied with the number of Questionmarks someone uses. However if this is all, what you are able to contribute.... your problem.
After this last sentence, if you had a minimum honor and sense of limits, you should blame your self for exposing your self to so obvious evidence of arrogance, ignorance and humiliation, and the only way to fix should be humble apologies to all. But I know you will not do it... Anyway, for the information of others, it’s enough to read the VSL MIR Pro manual: please go to page 20, point 4, line 2, and learn from the words of VSL what a “virtual microphone” is. On the other side, if you just were more familiar with digital audio, there was no need of asking “the holy bible of your religion” to believe and understand. It’s a pretty clear concept, and it’s pretty obvious it’s the way MIR IR work in MIR Pro, MIRx and Synchronized libraries.
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Anyway, for the information of others, it’s enough to read the VSL MIR Pro manual: please go to page 20, point 4, line 2, and learn from the words of VSL what a “virtual microphone” is.
Please read a bit more carefully This sentence is about the "meta format called Ambisonics" in which the Impuls responses for MIR have been recorded based on which the Output for the MIR Main output is calculated. But this does not change tha fact, that the Main Output of MIR is nothing but the Main Output givining you the whole simulated ambiance.. Beside the factg, that MIR does simulate the Synchron Venue and this is Part of the synchronized Liobnraries I dont see any direct relation, to the fact that a synchronized Library offers only one Recording from this Main Output in opposite to a couple of different mixable real "Microphone positions"
(And please try just to stay with the arguments we are talking about in this thread. No one is really interested here what ever you think about my person or niot.)
